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That’s so sweet!

piny

Brownfemipower gets tired.

i asked what makes me “exotic” looking–my boobs that can play patty cake with my knees, or my new glasses, or maybe my tendency to forget to comb my hair in the morning.

One of her commenters, I think, nailed the whole dynamic:

And yeah, I don’t know why people think “exotic” is a compliment. It basically says you don’t quite belong here, isn’t that sexy.

Mm-hm. In “The truth of brown motherhood,” she talked about being rendered foreign in another way: the other side of “exotic,” when people decide that you aren’t worth keeping around.

36 thoughts on That’s so sweet!

  1. It basically says you don’t quite belong here, isn’t that sexy.

    Or it says, “Good for you for not conforming to the standard beauty norm. I, for one, admire that and find it attractive.”

  2. Actually I “enjoy” being exotic. I don’t want to belong. I like being different, not part of the mainstream.

    But I guess it depends on who is saying it, and what their attitude towards different is. To me exotic is a compliment.

  3. I don’t enjoy being referred to as “exotic”. I interpret it both as the “you don’t quite belong here, do you?” dynamic, and the “like a rare animal; belongs in a zoo” vibe.

  5. When people say “exotic,” it’s not a label of Otherness insofar as it’s spoken reverently. People don’t call homosexuals “exotic” — the word isn’t used interchangeably with “different” or “odd.” It very obviously has positive connotation. Now, we can vivisect the semiotic, but I’m quite sure that there’s no inherent racism or sexism here.

  7. I’m not a fan of the “exotic” line either. And as I mentioned at BFP’s place, when someone doesn’t look “entirely” Mexican or “entirely” Cuban or “entirely” Black” or whatever, the “what are you?” question is for me equally as infuriating. The intention may be to compliment, but as La Luba says, it makes you feel like you should be in a Zoo or something (and don’t get me started on how much I HATE zoos).

  10. I’m a mutt, with the ethnically-ambiguous looks to match. It’s not unusual for a complete stranger to ask me where I’m from – often before they even know my name.

    Lately I’ve started making up answers, especially when the question is of the form “Are you from [country]?” – which I always answer in the affirmative. Makes for some interesting conversation. Or I have fun dragging out this exchange:

    “Where are you from?”
    “Ottawa.”
    “No…where were your parents from?”
    “Montreal.”
    “Uh…where were their parents born?”
    “Montreal too.”
    “No…I mean…”

    You’d think no one with ancestors outside Western Europe lived in this country before 1980.

  11. People don’t call homosexuals “exotic” — the word isn’t used interchangeably with “different” or “odd.”

    “People” don’t call homosexuals exotic because there aren’t many interfaith relationships, as it were. The people who openly fuck homosexuals are usually homosexual or queer themselves. It’s not okay to be sexually attracted to queers, in the objectifying sense or otherwise.

    Transsexuals definitely deal with fetishizing language; “exotic,” not necessarily, but “best of both worlds” and “shamanic” definitely, as well as an emphasis on the secret mysterious tranny genitalia. That is othering in the context of sexual attraction, and while it connotes desire, it does not necessarily connote respect.

  12. I am often asked where I’m from. My accent doesn’t match my looks, and I’m obviously not a White American (whatever mixture and background that is ;))

    It is only bothersome to me if I’m trying to get something done and just want to get on with it, but the question or the curiosity doesn’t bother me in the slightest.

    I see many “White Americans” launching into a description of how they are an eighth Scottish, a quarter Irish, an nth German, etc. etc. etc. I think that people are genuinely interested in cultures, and/or trying to make a connection.

    I have never felt insulted by the question, “where are you from.”

    Perhaps too, because I’ve lived all over the world, and have met many others who travel as much. “Where are you from” is a way of finding connections with other human beings. And even when someone who hasn’t left this country asks me where I’m from and I tell them my background, where I’ve lived, they are excited and want to share that they have always wanted to visit one of those countries, or are genuinely curious about the country, etc.

    So no, I don’t think exotic, or where are you from are insults — unless the person is purposely trying to insult.

  13. So no, I don’t think exotic, or where are you from are insults — unless the person is purposely trying to insult.

    I don’t think they’re purposeful insults, but they frequently exhibit a fairly high level of ignorance and serve as a proxy for “hey, why don’t you look like me and why do you sound funny?”

    Somewhat unrelatedly, is anyone else pained by the “Oh, I know someone else from Peru/Belgium/Australia/South Africa/etc.! Do you know so and so?” questions.

  14. Exotic—Variety is the spice of life. It would be a pretty boring world if we all looked the same. And exotic changes depending on where you are. I remember being in Japan and how people would constantly walk up to my little sister oohing and ahhing about her “blonde” (actually light brown, but evidently blonde by japanese standards)

    I love what Peshna, comment #12 says:
    ***I have never felt insulted by the question, “where are you from.”

    Perhaps too, because I’ve lived all over the world, and have met many others who travel as much. “Where are you from” is a way of finding connections with other human beings. And even when someone who hasn’t left this country asks me where I’m from and I tell them my background, where I’ve lived, they are excited and want to share that they have always wanted to visit one of those countries, or are genuinely curious about the country, etc.

    So no, I don’t think exotic, or where are you from are insults — unless the person is purposely trying to insult.***

    I know some people are bothered by it, but it is just a way of trying to connect. It’s not a question I would ask because someone looked different, though, it’s a question I would ask if they had an accent. I grew up in the melting pot of Southern California, I’ve traveled a lot, and I am truly interested in where you are from, and by extension, how that informs who you are.

    Of course, being from St. Louis for the last 25 years, my first question would actually be “What high school did you go to?” >snicker

  15. When people say “exotic,” it’s not a label of Otherness insofar as it’s spoken reverently

    It’s still a lable of otherness in that it’s a variation on idealizing the native.

    And it’s not fun. I am a white girl who looks just brown enough to be exotic, to get the “where are you from’s” and to have my luggage “randomly” searched 7 out of 8 times that I fly.

  16. Or it says, “Good for you for not conforming to the standard beauty norm”

    Ah, not conforming. Want to run a poll, ask 20 white girls with tattoos and piercings and 20 Gap-wearing girls of Asian descent how often members of each group get called “exotic”?

    “Not conforming” is something to be remarked on and complimented when it’s a choice, an action. Being nonwhite is neither. Treating nonwhite women as though they’d chosen their skin color and hair type on purpose to be sexually appealing is creepy and, yes, “othering,” even if the person making the remark believes he’s offering a compliment. Merely existing isn’t nonconformist behavior.

  17. I think “exotic” is an otherizing term. Whether it is meant to be a compliment is not the point. A lot of people say weird things that are wrong because they are oblivious, they have no intent to be weird or wrong, they are just entitled and privileged and don’t recognize things.

    The sad thing is that white people from the West when they travel to non-white countries are still treated as privileged. They can learn how annoying it is to get the “what are you” type questions but they can never learn about the patronizing because they are still on a pedestal. The only way for them to get it, I guess, is (like me) to be intimately involved with people of color and see their reactions to these types of things and see it happening.

    I really am grateful to people of color for being so patient to vocalize all this and explain it carefully instead of just giving up on white people entirely. It’s a real joy to read that post on motherhood or the one on “exotic” and think about something in a new way. But for the person of color, sometimes it must just get so awfully exhausting.

  18. I usually know that people mean well by saying that or they’re hitting on me. In my eyes, it’s true. I’m “different/exotic” looking in that I don’t look entirely asian or white. Just a good cross between the two. I dunno. I don’t take it personally.

    I used to take it more personally but at some point you have to get over what stupid things people say out of ignorance. But still, it is annoying and I definitely do understand the frustration.

  19. *sigh*

    Please remember, one doesn’t get tagged “exotic” in a vacuum. I’ve experienced the “exotic” tag either from white men who use it as shorthand for “gee, I’d like to fuck you, I just don’t want to have to take you out on actual dates and introduce you to my friends and family, and in general, treat you like a human being worthy of respect—I just think you’d make a cool sex toy for the night.”

    I’ve also experienced it as “huh. you don’t fit the standard midwestern beauty norm—in fact, you’re not even trying to—but yet….for some strange reason, I’m not finding you ugly! does not compute……does not compute…does not compute….”

    I can understand peshna’s response; that if you grow up globe-hopping, amongst other world travelers in cosmopolitan environments, that it can just be another way of relating. The flip side is, when you grow up as “the Other”, in the midst of people who for the most part have never traveled to a place where they could be considered “Other”, in fact, have never even left the state they were born in, “exotic” is a way of saying, “step back and know your place.” It’s also a reminder that you’re somewhat of a social outlaw for not trying hard enough to “fit in” physically.

    And it’s schizophrenic. I’ve been genuinely complemented on my hair (thick, wavy, black)—-yet have only encountered ONE hairdresser who didn’t suggest lightening or thinning it.

    I dunno. Maybe it’s just ‘cuz I grew up in the midwest. I’m “exotic” now, but that same “exoticness” had good white parents slamming the door in my face if I knocked on it, wanting to play kickball with their kids.

  20. Exotic is what they say about something on a menu they’ve never tried before. You’re different and better—-for a while. What you’re not is fully human.

  21. Isn’t it interesting how different life experiences have shaped the way we each perceive “exotic” or “other” or the question “where are you from?”

    To some it carries the implication that the norm is idealized, and that different is looked upon as a negative and used as a way to separate human beings.

    To others, it is about the great variety of culture and country and background that make up this world and about reaching out to make connections with other human beings.

  22. “Exotic” carries a definite connotation of “sexy” and “animalistic”. I wouldn’t be offended by the words “beautiful”, “pretty”, or “attractive”—but “exotic”? That’s a qualifier meant to carry the connotation that physical appearance isn’t all that’s being referred to.

    Look. I’m Sicilian. And there are a lot of stereotypes about Sicilian women, and some of them may even fit me. But among the many stereotypes associated with us, “intelligent”, “articulate”, “compassionate”, “polite”, etc. are not among them. The only “positive” stereotype we get to carry? You guessed it—“exotic”. We’re the passionate, exotic, spitfires, and we’re good for one thing only.

    I’ll trade you all the exotic spitfire crap in the world for the assumption that I can be something other than that.

  23. awww, come on, La Lubu. You know they mean “I bet you’re a freak in bed,” as a compliment. And you’re just uptight for not taking it as such.

  24. >>Somewhat unrelatedly, is anyone else pained by the “Oh, I know someone else from Peru/Belgium/Australia/South Africa/etc.! Do you know so and so?” questions.

  25. Sorry that split off somehow. I was going to add to the “somewhat unrelatedly…” #24

    chuckle… I don’t often bump into that kind of question, but once i a while.

    Once I found myself responding (in my head, I’d obviously not say this out loud) to the comment, “Oh, the head of our marketing department is also from….” with, “You are kidding, they let another one out?”

    But then I felt mean for thinking that. Yes, it was a very, very, unsophisticated comment, but so many people don’t have the travel and educational opportunities that I have had, and this person was, I believe, genuinely trying to connect with me.

  26. The “where are you from” thing very much depends on context. I travel quite a lot myself, and when I’m in another country where I clearly either don’t speak the language or speak it with a very different accent, it’s one thing for someone to ask me where I’m from. But when it happens in your own country where you speak like a native? Consider the following:

    My father was born in Austria. He came to this country when he was 8. He speaks like an American, without a trace of a non-American accent. No other American ever asks him where he is from.

    My dear friend was born in Egypt. She came to this country when she was 14. She speaks like an American, without a trace of a non-American accent. She is constantly asked by other Americans where she is from.

    Obviously the differentiating factor is appearance. My father appears to be a “typical” American. My friend does not. Therefore, people automatically assume she is not. She is Other. My father is not Other, despite not having been born here either.

  27. Obviously the differentiating factor is appearance

    But also true I think, if one is blonde, but with an accent? I have several foreign “white” friends who live over here right now, who are frequently asked where they are from, because of their accents.

  28. One final comment, is that in my opinion there is no way to define in advance, whether different, exotic, where you are from, etc. is intended or will be received as an insult.

    I just think that each person’s life experience is unique, and something like this could be intended as an insult (and be taken as a compliment) or intended as a way to connect (and be taken as an insult) – and sometimes you’ll be absolutely correct that it was intended as an insult — or that it was a compliment, or sometimes it was just something said to fill in an uncomfortable silence, and has no deeper meaning at all.

    Frankly, I’ve not even taken being called “darkie” as an insult. I “am” dark, and my only thought (I was a kid then) was to feel sorry for the kid that had called me that, because he clearly hadn’t had much opportunity to see the world and have international friends, and even at that age I understood that he needed to be mean to me because of his own issues, and that it had nothing to do with who I was.

    Then again, I’ve been very lucky to have had a lot of opportunities in life, and I’m sure that makes a difference.

    Anyway, just some thoughts for what they are worth…

  29. Yes, I agree regarding accents. My original statement was that if you are in another country and clearly don’t speak like a native, that is a different matter. I am never offended when I go to England and, despite speaking fluent English, people ask me where I’m from. Accent is one of the clearest signifiers of where you were born. I’m not even offended when I go to the Midwest and people ask me if I’m from New York. My accent is a dead giveaway. However, that is not an Othering question. It’s obvious I’m not originally from the region, even though I look no different from a native of the region.

    In this day and age, though, where immigration is very common, appearance is not a signifier of where you were born. Especially not in the United States. When another New Yorker asks my friend where she’s from, they are asking her because she does not fit their stereotype of what a “typical” American should look like, despite the fact that she speaks not much differently than I do or than they do. And believe me, no one in New York asks me where I’m from. In her case, though, those asking the question give no weight to the evidence of their aural sense. They just look at her and think “she’s different”, despite every other signifier that says she is not. Even when she answers them “From New York”, they often do not let it drop. “No, really, where are you from?” What else is that except an inability on their part to consider her like themselves?

  30. Sorry, I didn’t explain very well. What I meant when I commented that people also ask where “white” people with accents are from, is that I take that to mean that people are interested in ALL different cultures and countries and backgrounds and experiences and want to reach out and make connections.

    Plus I know many people here who are “Born American” and yet visit their parents’ country, have traditional parents living in the US, or who keep up their language and culture and traditions themselves, etc. So I don’t see “where are you from” as an unreasonable question of someone who may have an interesting culture and heritage to share? Maybe there’s a better way to phrase the question, but I don’t perceive the sentiment as rude or negative.

    I guess I just don’t experience it in a negative way, because I am so used to being surrounded by so many different cultures and colors and accents none of which necessarily match, and it is such a common question to ask and because my experience of cultural differences was one of people using those differences to connect, not to separate.

    So I experience the question of where I’m from (unless the person is obviously trying to be insulting) as one of genuine interest and a way of reaching out to connect with me, and not a negative “I don’t fit their stereotype of American.” (Whatever that is, and which I actually appreciate anyway, because I like being exotic ;))

    In fact, when people ask me where I’m from, I mostly forget that I’m American, because I view myself as a citizen of the world. And where I’m from is a much better explanation of who I am. Not a piece of paper or an accent.

    But I can see that if it is important for someone to be “American” or who has no connection to their heritage (assuming the person asking the question isn’t intending to be insulting), that it might be offensive or hurtful or just plain annoying. But I don’t think that the question is necessarily negative just because it is received that way.

    But again, we all see the world through our unique life experiences…

  31. PS. As for people who don’t let it drop, if the response they receive to their question of “where are you from” is “New York” well that’s a case for Ms. Manners 😉 That’s just plain obnoxious.

  32. Asking someone where they are from is not even close to the same as telling someone they are exotic or asking, “what are you?” The latter is, as has been pointed out already, a form of “othering” someone.

    Everyone has an accent (sorry, that’s a pet peeve of mine).

  33. Everyone has an accent (sorry, that’s a pet peeve of mine).

    Chuckle – this is true. I always laugh when I’m asked by someone who has commented on mine, “Do I have an accent.” I respond, Of course you do, you have an American accent 😉

    But I think in the context of this discussion, it means a non-American accent (or an “other” ore “exotic” accent ;))

  34. The latter is, as has been pointed out already, a form of “othering” someone.

    I think the question is not whether or not exotic means different, but rather… is “different” necessarily negative?

    My point of view is that in my experience it is not. I’m very happy to be exotic and different, and I’m also interested in the lives of those who come from different backgrounds than mine.

    It appears that how people react to being called exotic, depends on their life experience of being different? Mine has been very positive. I was raised with so many different cultures and colors, that different, perhaps even became the norm!

  35. Yes, everyone has an accent story. Anyone with a southern drawl who moves north of the Mason-Dixon line gets asked “where are you fron?” I have a friend from Atlanta and she jokes that if she ran out of a burning building yelling “fire” people would say, “Where are you from” before they asked where the fire was….

    Me, I’m White, of potato-famine Irish ancestry, and what *I* get is, “I know someone who looks just like you!” and I always ask, “do you know if their family was from Ireland?” and the answer is always yes. There are some 40 million people in the U.S.A. of Irish descent. I will never be called exotic by anyone in this country.

    As for “do you know my cousin,” travel in the Third World and when you explain you’re American people go, “do you know my cousin in Houston?’ or “Detroit” or “LA” and then I explain to them that America has over 300 million people in it and I’ve never been in any of those places.

  36. The whole exotic thing is weird. I’ve been told that I’m exotic plenty of times… by white men (I’m Black) living in New York. NEW YORK. As if there aren’t a million black women running around here. We’re all over the friggin’ subways, the city streets, everywhere!

    It’s about an unwillingness to acknowledge the “other,” unless she gives you a boner, I think. And since she’s giving you a boner, she can’t be part of the lumpen other mass: she’s gotta be an “exotic.”

    Or something.

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