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11 thoughts on Women are welcome at Yahoo events

  1. Ok, I’m convinced that they are doing this stuff on purpose to garner publicity. Something like this has happened what, like 150 times already?

  2. Quite possibly. If they were able to get away with this in the US they might spark more of an interest into Americans going into technology and not just into law, medicine, and MBAs. Though I think it should be mentioned that this happened in Taiwan. Eastern cultures are more relaxed about sexuality and this kind of thing is not at all unusual at business meetings. The dynamics are completely different than what they might be at a similar meeting in US.

  3. It’s not unusual to have lap-dancers at a business meeting because Eastern cultures are more relaxed about sexuality? Something about that statement just isn’t ringing true to me…

  4. As long as the sexuality is “women providing the sex, men consuming it,” yes, they are more “relaxed.” And while these things aren’t at all unusual at business meetings in Asia, there is a huge problem with women making inroads in business. Given that it’s women, not men, who are equated with “sex,” I would argue that it isn’t about people being more relaxed about sex. This is about showcasing women in their place as subservient to men.

    And there have been plenty of examples of rank sexism and entitled misogyny among techies here in the US–check out the Gawker link for a few examples. And it’s not as if feminists and women techies haven’t called it out when it’s happened in the States. To try and dismiss the very justified outrage at this as so much cultural myopia is bullshit.

  5. I used to see “booth babes” at trade shows of all kinds (even wrote an article about them), but they were especially predominant at the more techie-oriented ones. They disappeared for awhile, but seem to be making a comeback.

    I’m not sure if this was supposed to reflect heightened sexism among techies. As far as I could tell, the reasoning was that techies are so socially maladept and starved for female attention that they would be especially susceptible to booth babes. Which manages to be insulting to everyone concerned, when you think about it.

  6. If they were able to get away with this in the US they might spark more of an interest into Americans going into technology and not just into law, medicine, and MBAs.

    Yeah, because there’s a shortage of women-as-consumable-sex-objects imagery in the tech. fields in the US.

    Actually, it’s interesting that you mention law, medicine, and MBAs.

    Medical schools have currently slightly more women than men.
    Women make up about one-third of those enrolled in MBA programs.
    Law school enrollment has essentially gender parity (~48% female as of 2006).

    Now, undergraduate CS programs (which, I’d argue, is more relevant for looking at the career pipeline of software engineers than graduate enrollment):

    22% female, as of 2004-2005 (cite), and as of then it was trending downward. I’m actually surprised – looking around my workplace – that the number’s that high.

    Given this, and given the truly huge gender gap in how CS is perceived as a major, it occurs to me that your “make women feel they aren’t welcome as engineers but only as sex objects” strategy may not be the most productive one to pursue.

  7. As a computer science major, I’m positively trembling with anxiety about what kind of shit I’m going to have to put up after college. šŸ™ This kind of thing doesn’t make it any better.

  8. Sara, on a local level – that is, when dealing with the male geeks around you with whom you have to work – the strategy I adopted was this:

    The first time someone cracks one of those jokes* in your presence, fix them with a steely eye (practice this part) and say in a steely voice (really practice this part) “I don’t find that kind of joke funny”. Then drop the subject. You don’t need to explain or justify it or say anything else or treat the guy who made the joke any differently.

    The first time someone suggests going to an event with lapdancers or a bar with strippers as a “work outing”, say no, keep saying no, propose alternative venue, say flatly and again with explanation or justification that you don’t care for “that sort of thing” and you want to be included in the work outing, propose alternative venue.

    The first time you spot a porn shot on a co-workers computer, tell them politely and even apologetically that in your view the workplace isn’t the place for that sort of thing – home computers yes, their business, work computers no.

    Avoid getting into a political discussion about why you find it objectionable. Indeed, avoid a why discussion at all. Just keep saying flatly and politely and – coldly, if they persist – that you “don’t care for it”. But the important thing is: do it from the start. Never allow any group of men where you are the only woman to get away with treating you as “one of the boys”.

    Male geeks can be sexist, obnoxious bastards. But in my experience, they react well to a clear statement of “I feel uncomfortable when you do this, and I want you to stop”. Further, if you stick to that line, and one of them persists, you have a case for pointing him out as a workplace bully.

  9. with explanation or justification

    without explanation or justification.

    Also, *joke – I didn’t think I had to explain what kind of joke is one of those kind of jokes, do I?

  10. Sara P.: I have a BS in CS, and three of my classmates are now my closest male friends. They’re radical feminists compared to a lot of the men I work with now: techies who spent a lot of time in the Army, working primarily for men who retired from the Army or who are currently in it, along with a few women who spent their careers pushing for their own, and other women’s, fair chances in that extremely male-dominated culture.

    I deal with inappropriate remarks and conversations about others (they know better than to say anything about ME) by getting up, walking back to my desk and asking them, “don’t y’all have any work to do?”, or giving a disapproving look and attempting to change the subject. That often sends the signal that they need to find something else to talk about. Unfortunately, I know that they’re watching their mouths out of a sense of chivalry and not a desire to be more egalitarian, but it maintains my ability to work with them in this very “male” job, making “male” amounts of money, and by my young female presence, chipping away the least little bit at the notion that this is a job for men.

    Politely but firmly state your opposition to any inappropriate comments or attention directed at you. That’s what I’ve done the few times it’s come up, and it has, with one exception, nipped it in the bud. That exception required convincing him that no, I had a boyfriend who was younger/better educated/fitter than that guy, so no use bothering. I’m not particularly proud of that, but a gal’s gotta do what a gal’s gotta do. Feminist theory is all good and well for understanding your situation, but dealing with men who think that listening to the words “feminist theory” will turn them gay (and of course, there’s no worse thing possible to those guys) requires blunter instruments sometimes when it’s a matter of being able to comfortably work a job you otherwise like.

    I have not found a good way to handle hurtful talk about other groups (homophobia runs rampant…) I hope you are better at it, but even if you’re as tongue-tied as I am, just by being present and persistent, you’ll be doing your part to show others that this IS a career field for women.

  11. Iā€™m not sure if this was supposed to reflect heightened sexism among techies. As far as I could tell, the reasoning was that techies are so socially maladept and starved for female attention that they would be especially susceptible to booth babes.

    Well, the fact that they assumed that all techies and geeks are male is pretty sexist.

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