No Blog Indispensable August 29, 2005 Lauren Kos: I mean to say, “where’s them damn burkas when you need them?” Charming.
When I hear non-white males attack women like that, why do I have the urge to hurl racial slurs at them? Maybe ’cause, mean as it is, I know I can hurt them like they hurt others. I don’t do it, of course. But I always think it. Meanwhile, though one can’t tell these things just by looking, I’m the son of an immigrant, and I’ll keep advocating for people who weren’t born here, and people whose parents weren’t born here. Kos will just have to learn what it feels like to be thrown under the bus from someone else. That makes me better than him. Oh, yes it does.
No, Thomas, that just reminds us you’re better than him. Whatever made you better than Kos happened long ago.
Nice kos. please demonstrate to me one more time why minority groups can’t stand working with white middle class males. Ass. Why the hell should I vote democrat again? Does kos realize that the majority of America does NOT read his blog? The people he wants to convert to the democratic party want a leader who has the courage to step up and firmly state what (s)he believes. The republican party’s willingness to do so (albeit they have stances I firmly disagree with) is a big reason why the democratic party didn’t get the votes of the people whom they expected to. Kos and many others in the democratic party are cowards. I’m sorry, but there is just no other way to state it. In an effort to appeal to everyone, kos & co are going to end up appealing to no one. Great post by mediagirl. I’m going to have to bookmark her page…
There was a lot of bullshit on that thread. Thank God for diaries, especially for the perspective of the main post. After all, she does write: It is important for reluctant gate-keepers of the progressive movement like Markos at DailyKos and Steve Gilliard at NewsBlog to take responsibility for their actions and their posts because they have the effect of triviliazing and marginalizing feminist bloggers. And yet her diary entry got promoted to the main site and initial positive comments from Kos and Armando. (The excerpted quote was an ill-advised rejoinder to an ill-advised, anti-ecumenical comment, however true the comment might have been. The commenter went on to ascribe ulterior motives to Liza’s post getting bumped). It’s also valuable to question the fallibility of NARAL, which seems to have the political savvy of tree moss these days (e.g. it doesn’t matter if Chafee is pro-choice; if he votes to confirm anti-choice judges where a pro-choice Democrat wouldn’t, that’s all that matters. The Senate can’t pass anti-choice legislation while Roe v. Wade is on the books). Hopefully, some of the networking and fence-mending suggested by Liza can assist in preserving choice. And, as usual, the rest of mediagirl’s post was enlightening, personalities aside.
See Lauren, I thought that was funny in an asshole sort of way. Like the pie ads. Neither did I have a problem with them. Given this comment was done on my diary on a post I sent out to a lot of feminist bloggers, who have no responded to it directly, please pray tell, what’s so wrong with the throw away asshole comment that people have to wish Lorena Bobbit on him? Come on. Seriously. Media Girl is the only one who has done an extensive comment but only within the context of what was discussed at DailyKos, the ‘guys’ blog. Most of y’all ignored the post when it appeared in culturekitchen (which was about a day before). So, I invite you to shred the post apart. I have no problem with people not liking what I wrote about. I sincerely do not expect a lot of my fellow feminist bloggers to like. Part of it is cultural. I still don’t think it is a coincidence that it is a latino and a black man mainly your target. The history of progressive activism on our end of the political spectrum is very different from the ‘white’ left. Troubled, yeah, but most importantly different. The other reason is generational. I am a geezer by a lot of standards and feminism was not a word that became part of my activism vocabulary until I was a young adult : I mean, when you’re a socialist fighting an imperialist power, feminism is part of a continuum, not the single issue (all pun intended). And most of it is just the way I see the political world : I have a sincere dislike for binary oppositions. “Us against them” is too easy, too cliched. Usually the opposition becomes the opposed. I like always to look at a third, fourth, fifth way. Here’s the link : http://www.culturekitchen.com/archives/003274.html I welcome the discussion and debate.
I wanted to write about your post when it went up on Culture Kitchen, but then I felt stupid for missing the phone call and retreated in embarrassment. I think Daily Kos is a good blog that does a good service. I think Markos sort of hides behind the big man mocks the little woman thing when he’s backed into a corner. Doesn’t make it right, but I can certainly sympathize with his defensiveness.
I read more of it – he refers to feminism as “women’s stuff.” Y’know, like the stockings hanging in the shower, the weird-smelling fragrances, all those girly things he doesn’t understand as opposed to the real manly fight. Why is it that the Democrats who want to market themselves as “reasonable” think that jettisoning women’s rights is the best way to make themselves look moderate?
I’m incredibly tired of the “just a guy with a blog” routine when Kos is spending time with the DNC and announcing hints to secret behind the scenes happenings before we know what’s up. Whether or not I stand with NARAL (and at this point I don’t care, sorry) I’m tired of being written off as a “women’s studies chick” who only cares about the vag. I realize feminism is an unpopular term, but I don’t care to be beaten down by the guys on “our side.” Like Amanda, I didn’t respond to the NARAL post by Liza because I missed the NARAL call (I was out of town that day) and had no context for the information posed by Liza like the accusations of maternalism. I don’t doubt that they wished for us to be their beacon of light in the blogosphere, but frankly, most of us feminist bloggers are relegated to vaginistan and our words rarely pass over to the big dudes that carry real weight. And why? Well, Kos’ comments here are a perfect example why. We can only get recognition when we cause a kerfluffle — from the WAATFPB crap to the pie fight crap to the NARAL crap. No wonder we appear shrill.
Now that I’m rereading Liza’s original essay, I have to agree wholeheartedly with this: To go back to Chris Nolan’s description of bloggers, if the feminists are the philosophers of the blogosphere, then we see the issues from a systemic point of view. It’s why the body is as important as Iraq. It’s not that we don’t think war is trivial. If you read any of the top feminist bloggers you can see a common thread : We believe we need to look at the social practices that got us to Iraq in the first place. If the personal is political, then we need to look at what we do on a very personal, very private day to day that helps create the social infrastructure for people like Bush to consolidate power. You can take Bush down, but that does not solve all the issues. At culturekitchen, Jeff Langstraat, Lorraine Berry and I are very much against the war. But when we write about dominionism, the ex-gay movement or rape, we write about these within a context of how they pave the way to not just Iraq, but an endless war between the haves and have nots; between Individuals and Power. Again, not being able to comment on the NARAL call, this is the fundamental misunderstanding within the Democratic/progressive mission — all these things are connected. This isn’t an issue of just Iraq or just abortion or just gay marriage. The inherent structures that make these things so controversial are the roadblocks to freedom. That Kos does not seem to recognize this, based on many of his statements over the last year, is infinitely defeating.
Alot of what I see going on with Kos and with this issue at large has to do with power, who has it and who wants it. It has nothing to do with the issue of Roe –which the majority of Americans support.
i don’t get kos’ jihad against NARAL. he literally makes no sense when he defends it. he wants an abortion-rights group to endorse an anti-abortion candidate just because he has a “D” next to his name? if they did, they would just become an appendage of the democratic party, what would be the point of an issue-oriented organization like NARAL if they didn’t ultimately advocate for that issue? besides, kos argues that NARAL has failed and wants them to become a subsidiary of the democratic party. but who has failed more, the dems or NARAL? 60-70% of the public is pro-choice, and yet dems have lost every branch of government. if the democratic party want to succeed, perhaps they should become an appendage of NARAL.
See Lauren, I thought that was funny in an asshole sort of way. Like the pie ads. Neither did I have a problem with them. Given this comment was done on my diary on a post I sent out to a lot of feminist bloggers, who have no responded to it directly, please pray tell, what’s so wrong with the throw away asshole comment that people have to wish Lorena Bobbit on him? Come on. Seriously So his comment is funny in an asshole sort of way but mine isn’t funny. Explain to me why would it be okay for Kos to make obnoxious, insulting remark about something that is actually quite terrible but it’s not okay for me to do the same. Let’s see, one snipped penis versus the suffering of women under the Taliban. Clearly, I have no sense of proportion. I’m 55, I’ve had lifetime of those oh so funny, don’t you have a sense of humor, boys-just-being-boys asshole jokes. And I’m fucking sick of them and being told that I just need to be a good sport about it.
Context can be highly informative in many situations, but is rarely appreciated except in its absence.
So Lauren, Rox, Amanda, MediaGirl : I have a proposition. Rox fowarded to me a statement of support for NARAL and opposition to Roberts put out by “Concerned Colored Women”. How about if we use Feminist Bloggers as a banner name and do the same? I’ll write something up at my blog and then ping y’all about it. A statement against Roberts that also states our support to all the organizations out there like NARAL and People for the American Way who are working real hard to lift the veil off this nomination. And have feminist bloggers –women and men– sign it. That means we need to get some emails together so we can send a press release out. Any readers out there willing to helping out with this? Let me know.
Abortion is not just a women’s issue. It affects men, women and children and to call it “women’s stuff” is simplistic and false. “he wants an abortion-rights group to endorse an anti-abortion candidate just because he has a “D” next to his name?” re: PA Senate race – I have been following this for a little while. Although Casey (the Democratic candidate) opposes most abortions, he at least supports access to birth control, which his Republican opponent Santorum believes is “harmful to women” (no joke).
but I can certainly sympathize with his defensiveness Why? Because he’s Big Blog Guy? Because he’s a man and we girls should all rush to soothe his hurt fee-fees? I don’t get it. BTW, from a legal perspective, both Liza and mediagirl are completely wrong on ‘privacy’. There is no generic “legal right to freedom.” There is a right to privacy, which SCOTUS has held is a natural result of the Fourth Amendment, and which underpins Roe. I don’t suppose I also needed to note that Kos also has his head up his ass about why we supposedly don’t need an ERA. In HIS reading, women have equal rights–well then! We’ll get the Supreme Court right on that one!
Kate said “Abortion is not just a women’s issue. It affects men, women and children and to call it “women’s stuff” is simplistic and false.” You’d think progressives, liberals and Democrats would get that…but they don’t. Sad.
Liza: Rox fowarded to me a statement of support for NARAL and opposition to Roberts put out by “Concerned Colored Women”. How about if we use Feminist Bloggers as a banner name and do the same? I’ll write something up at my blog and then ping y’all about it. I received that statement off-the-record, but without attribution or citation, I was not comfortable posting it — especially since I’m of that catch-all racial category: “white.” mythago: BTW, from a legal perspective, both Liza and mediagirl are completely wrong on ‘privacy’. There is no generic “legal right to freedom.” There is a right to privacy, which SCOTUS has held is a natural result of the Fourth Amendment, and which underpins Roe. I suggest that you read the 1992 decision, mythago. Though abortion is conduct, it does not follow that the State is entitled to proscribe it in all instances. That is because the liberty of the woman is at stake in a sense unique to the human condition, and so, unique to the law. The mother who carries a child to full term is subject to anxieties, to physical constraints, to pain that only she must bear. That these sacrifices have from the beginning of the human race been endured by woman with a pride that ennobles her in the eyes of others and gives to the infant a bond of love cannot alone be grounds for the State to insist she make the sacrifice. Her suffering is too intimate and personal for the State to insist, without more, upon its own vision of the woman’s role, however dominant that vision has been in the course of our history and our culture. The destiny of the woman must be shaped to a large extent on her own conception of her spiritual imperatives and her place in society. Citations and discussion at the link above.
Well the “Kos Coalition” failed disasterously in it’s attempts to fete Jon Tester… all that hot air and added only ONE person to Tester’s Act Blue fundraiser… Kos is a typical DLC Democrat politician… he shits all over the base then expects them to PAY for the priviledge.
I suggest that you read the 1992 decision, mythago. I really liked your post on that, mediagirl. The html for it went wrong so I’m giving it again here: I think people should read what you have to say about liberty and privacy. mediagirl on 1992 decision
God is Kos ever frustrating. It’s exactly that narrow vision of what progressive values entail that makes the Democratic Party so infuriating—I moved on and joined the DSA.
I can sympathize with Kos’s desire as a blogger to be himself and not have to care about offending people, but that’s the curse of being the kingpin of the progressive activist blogosphere, I guess, that he really should worry about not offending people. Not just because he should accept some responsibility as an important voice, but because as an activist, it doesn’t make sense to alienate people on your own side. And it’s an issue he really does try to have both ways, as I believe a post by Media Girl makes pretty clear.
Hey, Y’all I posted the letter on all three of my blogs. I was going to put it on my blog at MediaGirl, but didn’t get around to it. Now is the time to come together as sisters. Kos and his ilk won’t change if they know in a crunch they can count on our votes. We are 53% of the electorate, and they need to learn that they ignore out rights at their peril. If the Democrats were an effective opposition party, I might not take such an extreme position, but they aren’t – the idiots have all but said that they’re going to confirm Roberts without a fight. It would be a tragic mistake for us to underestimate the damage this man can do. I’m not exaggerating when I say he’ll take us back to the 1750’s – no right to privacy, no right to vote, no right to sovereeignty over our own bodies and our lives. Forget about the Violence Against Women Act, forget the Voting Rights act, and kiss all forms of affirmitive action goodbye. We have to be unmovable in our refusal to support a candidate that it anti-choice. Without us, any candidate is doomed, anyway, so let’s use the numbers we have to get what we want. These half-assed candidates who dance around with ideas like “safe, legal and rare” or “civil unions” as opposed to full marriage rights can’t win – the core of the Democratic Party is pissed and only really gets vocal when somebody stands up, be it Howard Dean, Paul Hackett, or Cindy Sheehan. This is not the time to compromise – this is the time to stand firm. It will benefit no one for us to sacrifice our values and our rights for a position that cannot win anyway. Solidarity is our only effective choice