Feministing Party TONIGHT!

13 thoughts on Feministing Party TONIGHT!

1. If you want to go to some fucking book party go to a fucking book party, you don’t need a asterisk and a disclaimer. Jesus. This has fallen to self-parody.

   Stop apologizing.

2. Eh?? Margalis, point me to the apology in the post??

   What are you on about? Jill hasn’t tried to justify or explain what she’s doing. She’s ADVERTISING a feministing party, and feels that the only responsible way to do that is also to mention the controversy.

   I think she handled it very well. Stop reading into things that aren’t there.

3. FYI, I am boycotting Seal Press.

4. I didn’t apologize. I just figured that if I’m going to mention a book published by a press that’s controversial in the feminist blogosphere, I should mention the controversy so that people know what’s going on and, as I said in the post, make up their own minds. I think that’s the responsible thing to do.

   But it is funny how you come here, act like an asshole, basically tell me that I made a mistake in mentioning the Seal Press controversy, and then demand that I not apologize… to those other people. But I suppose I should be sorry that I somehow ticked you off by putting more information in the post?

   This is ridiculous.

5. Yeah that post would have been way better if it was scrubbed clean of any mention of a boycott that people might have to think or read or decide for themselves about! Quality +100%, information is like a horrible stain on an otherwise innocent event listing.

6. Everytime you mention Amanda, Seal Press or anything in that universe you include a disclaimer that often eclipses the original post, and your opinion has meandered all over in a seeming attempt to please everyone.

   Mentioning the controversy is not in itself a problem. The problem is that when you broach these subjects you take a defensive posture and your comments don’t ring true – they appear to be for the purpose of deflecting criticism rather than your honest opinion.

   “(although it was finished before the Seal editors made their two most recent major gaffes)” is justifying, and glosses over the fact that Jessica herself is part of the controversy.

   Why is “incredibly offensive” parenthetical? Do *you* believe the actions were incredibly offensive, or are you throwing a bone to those that do?

   Why do people need to be told that they can make up their own minds or that they can “decide for themselves?” Is that permission or a reminder? (Why anyone would need either eludes me)

   I don’t see any problem in mentioning the controversy/boycott. But I do see that your (Jill) posts on this are routinely out-of-character and overly affected.

   But I suppose I should be sorry that I somehow ticked you off by putting more information in the post?

   That would be silly.

7. Everytime you mention Amanda, Seal Press or anything in that universe you include a disclaimer that often eclipses the original post, and your opinion has meandered all over in a seeming attempt to please everyone.

   …and you clearly have no idea what you’re talking about. Last time I posted about a feminist event (featuring Amanda, actually), I didn’t include any sort of disclaimer. As a result, people were upset that I didn’t mention a pertinent controversy.

   And before that (which was what, a month ago?) I don’t think I ever included any sort of disclaimer about either Jessica or Amanda in three years of blogging here. I like both of them, I respect both of their work, and I’ve advertised their events and their works many times over. I only put in a disclaimer this time because there is a big divide in the feminist blogosphere over whether to support Seal, and I think those who support the boycott have very valid points that readers are entitled to know about.

   And yes, my opinion has “meandered” quite a bit. That’s because I can see valid points from a variety of angles, and I’m not one of those people who decides something and then sticks to it no matter what other information is presented. I reserve the right to actually think about things and to change my mind.

   “(although it was finished before the Seal editors made their two most recent major gaffes)” is justifying, and glosses over the fact that Jessica herself is part of the controversy.

   So now I didn’t give enough information about the controversy?

   Why is “incredibly offensive” parenthetical? Do *you* believe the actions were incredibly offensive, or are you throwing a bone to those that do?

   I believe their actions were incredibly offensive. I also know that they’ve apologized and are trying to remedy things. But the apology isn’t mine to accept or evaluate, so I’m simply giving my opinion that the editors’ comments and decisions have been offensive.

   Why do people need to be told that they can make up their own minds or that they can “decide for themselves?” Is that permission or a reminder? (Why anyone would need either eludes me)

   I wasn’t telling people that they needed to make up their own minds; I was explaining why I put up the disclaimer.

   I don’t see any problem in mentioning the controversy/boycott. But I do see that your (Jill) posts on this are routinely out-of-character and overly affected.

   Well, fine. I don’t see why you really care, though, if there isn’t a problem in mentioning the controversy. You care because it’s out-of-character? Then I would suggest that you don’t know my character very well — because these inter-feminist controversies do affect me very deeply, and I do try to learn from them and deal with them as best I can. I often stumble, but I’m trying to at least show that I respect the varying opinions and viewpoints here.

   So I’m still not seeing how you have any sort of argument at all.

8. Respect is not the same as deference. If you were personally offended why isn’t it your place to evaluate the apology?

   I wasn’t telling people that they needed to make up their own minds; I was explaining why I put up the disclaimer.

   !

   Everyone is an adult here, there is no need to tread so lightly. At some point adopting a maximally innoffensive and explanatory tone is less respect than treating people like children. Your disclaimer is couched in odd language that is less like an equal than like a professor or parent. (I think GallingGalla picked up on that in her response; note the parallel construction)

   Acknowledging controversy is fine in the context of you’re an adult, I’m an adult, I think one thing but other people disagree for legitimate reasons. But the way you approach this subject just reads off.

   You are trying to tread so softly that it’s warping your writing into a mess, both overly deferential and dismissive at once.

9. Yikes. For what it’s worth, Jill, I read your note and thought that was a nice, classy, respectful way to support your friend and also acknowledge the controversy surrounding Seal Press.

10. I agree with Brenda that you handled this well, Jill.

    And it seems like Margolis has an agenda (not that I can figure out what it is, unless it’s maybe “drive Jill nuts”).

11. Jill, for real, don’t give this muppet any more of your time. I’ll restate that I thought you balanced this post excellently (and like Galla, I’m boycotting Seal Press).

    The irony of demanding you explain why you (supposedly) keep explaining yourself is hilarious though.

12. Perhaps actually putting the situation in your own words instead of sending people to a blog that has been locked while the author is on vacation would have been the best route. While I recognizing your intent, I did pause to see that there is a link to my locked blog and that it is a link to the first of three posts which only addresses the initial comments made at Black Amazon’s and not the actual issues at hand. It goes quite nicely with Seal Press’ dismissal of people mentioning the girlcott by saying that I took a “flame war” out of context and used it as an excuse to misrepresent Seal Press and cut into their circulation. Hardly the case, since these issues have been debated in one form or another since the cover controversy on Amanda’s book almost 1 year ago.

    I’m on vacation. My blog is locked. Many women, especially women of color, have weighed in on this. Use a source people can reach or if you want to use my blog as the source in the future, use the piece that actually addresses the girlcott or link to all of the posts (3 of them) so people get a sense of the herstory here. Better yet, you have weighed in eloquently on so many issues, and are now a lawyer (passed the bar?) so you should be able to express your sense of the issues on your own, without simply pointing to someone else, and then pointing people to “other opinions” or concurring opinions including those of Seal Press themselves. It would have been nice also, since this is Jessica’s book, to point to the FFF issues raised by several woc bloggers rather than just sending them to me and saying there is an SP controversy. (Of course many of those blogs have also been locked down or scrubbed as a result of feeling abused, misrepresented, or misappropriated b/c of the two latest intersecting controversies.). It would have been an opportunity to consider both the new cover, that shows a learning curve of sorts AND to reflect on Jessica’s own stance, she wrote a post on it, on how she feels she can continue to work with Seal Press and uphold intersectional feminist ideals and how she believes Seal can make a change.

    I’m sure many of us have privately and, some now publicly, written about how you could do these posts differently. Ultimately this is your blog and your voice. I hope that my constructive criticisms are taken in the vein they are offered and not as more proof that “well-meaning white feminists cannot win in discussions of race” – it is not about winning but rather learning to speak responsibly and across cultures which can take a lot of learning and unlearning to do well. As I said, I almost did not weigh in on this at all b/c it just seemed pointless on multiple levels. And the fact that silence, which is not protecting any of us, seems like the ideal position to so many woc bloggers right now is one we should all be working to shift not by cursory links but by engaging the subjects clearly and with the same feminist tools with which we engage global, national, and local issues involving women.

13. PS. If you want to keep reading and supporting authors on Seal Press during the girlcott that is your choice and it is a political stand. Take it and own it b/c a head nod to other people’s positions does not erase or explain your choices. If you have an opinion about why Jessica and Amanda’s books should be bought, read, supported through wide scale circulation of their book openings and encouragement to show up, during a girlcott then why not explain that to the readers of your blog? Why not offer an alternative view of how to address race, gender, and publishing? Or how to support authors’ work but not their press? or why you see a disconnect between the authors you have advertised here, who have been involved in parts of this controversy for their own choices, and the Press’ actions? Regardless of how any of us feels about these issues, we are all making choices and sending messages about them, and it is important to be able to articulate what those choices are.

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