In defense of the sanctimonious women's studies set || First feminist blog on the internet

The Kids Are All Right

Jill

After all the depressing stories yesterday, I bring you good news:

–Young Americans are leaning left. Forty-four percent support marriage equality. Twenty-eight percent describe themselves as liberal. Sixty-two percent support a government-sponsored healthcare program. Seventy-five percent of them are generally pro-choice, even though about half of that 75 percent favor greater restrictions.

By a 52 to 36 majority, young Americans say that Democrats, rather than Republicans, come closer to sharing their moral values, while 58 percent said they had a favorable view of the Democratic Party, and 38 percent said they had a favorable view of Republicans.

We’re also optimistic, even about the Iraq quagmire. I think that’s a good thing, provided that optimism helps to positively influence reality.

-High school seniors who were honored by President Bush for their academic accomplishments handed him a letter urging him to end torture. Awesome. Thanks to Elizabeth for the link.

-Feminist artists have created The Feminist Art Project, and it looks pretty awesome. Their work will be all over the country — see if there’s an event near you. Thanks to Roy for the link.

–Cheney’s office and the White House have been subpoenaed. Yeehaw! Thanks to Louise for the link.

-And there’s a new Die Hard movie coming out. Sweet.

You all have sufficiently cheered me up. Gracias.

124 thoughts on The Kids Are All Right

  1. -High school seniors who were honored by President Bush for their academic accomplishments handed him a letter urging him to end torture.

    Dick Cheney had to be held back by Secret Service agents to keep him from shooting the insubordinate kids…

  2. Dick Cheney had to be held back by Secret Service agents to keep him from shooting the insubordinate kids…

    And I’m pretty sure that’s in the blooper reel of the new Die Hard movie.

  3. An old saying: If you are not liberal when you are young you have no heart. If you are not conservative when you are old you have no brain.

  5. Off-topic mess: in the latest update on the pro wrestler murder/suicide case, the Associated Press sees fit to inform us that he and his wife “had argued over childcare” in the days before the murders.

    Now taking bets on how long it takes the assholes to form the words “bitch had it coming” again, and concern troll women with “this is what happens when you insist that men do their share of housework and childcare.

  6. It sucks to think this way…but you just have to wait for the older generations to die out. That’s the way its always worked in becoming more progressive.

    BTW, I love your banner image!!

  7. An old saying: If you are not liberal when you are young you have no heart. If you are not conservative when you are old you have no brain.

    Then I guess I’ve lost a brain but gained a heart over the past 20 years. I’m okay with that.

  8. “An old saying: If you are not liberal when you are young you have no heart. If you are not conservative when you are old you have no brain.”

    So we’re not the first people to watch their politicians try to explain why it’s totally not flip-flopping when they do it? Good to know.

  9. Yeah but just wait till the next batch of Quiverfull babies grow up. I have a nasty feeling this is only a temporary thing, something about the insane birthrate of the other side.

  10. As the saying goes ” . . . until the first paycheck . . . ”

    That pesky witholding statement on my paystub sets me right straight every two weeks.

    I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

  11. An old saying: If you are not liberal when you are young you have no heart. If you are not conservative when you are old you have no brain.

    Dad?

  13. “Yeah but just wait till the next batch of Quiverfull babies grow up. I have a nasty feeling this is only a temporary thing, something about the insane birthrate of the other side.”

    Most of the women I know who grew up in deliberately big families are so thoroughly disillusioned with the lifestyle that it’s not even funny. Something about being co-opted as unpaid labor to support your parents’ decisions–decisions that leave you with less in regards to their time, attention, and financial support both now and in the future–seems to have disagreed with them.

    I suspect bolting from the fold will grow even more tempting if demands on mothers keep going up. If you know you’ll be expected to not just be a full-time mom who breastfeeds and makes all-organic home-cooked meals for her dozen children but also be a perfect housekeeper and homeschool the lot of them and never lose your figure as well as being a surrendered wife who’s totally into that Christian spanking thing, you’re far more likely to just say “Fuck that” and check yourself out of the movement.

  15. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    Wow, I’m surprised they make pants with a crotch big enough to hold all that…

    [/snark]

  17. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    Wow, I’m surprised they make pants with a crotch big enough to hold all that…

    [/snark]

    Thanks, but the crotch is all Uncle Sam’s, and the ass is mine.

    I figure I am raising two families, maybe one in Appalachia, maybe one in Detroit. Neither have the courtesy to send a Christmas card. There is probably some no talent asshole mocking my religion with dung and chocolate, or both, and I’m footing the bill for that too. Thanks once again for the concern.

  18. And we appreciate your freedom to whine about how you paid more in taxes than many of us made in actual income last year.

    Really classy, that.

  19. Tony’s just pissed that I used my welfare check to pay for my gold-plated grill and he doesn’t even get to wear it. Don’t hate the player.

  20. And we appreciate your freedom to whine about how you paid more in taxes than many of us made in actual income last year.

    Really classy, that.

    Well, I guess we both wish that weren’t so. How the hell would I know what “any of you” make anyway? And I guess there won’t be much bellyaching that I “don’t pay my fair share?”

    Point made – I am really interested in how that money is being spent or wasted, because apparently I’m in a one way partnership with the government.

  21. You’re right Tony, you don’t really know what any of us make, what we do, how much we take from the government or how much we give back. So speculating that we’re liberals simply because we don’t feel the apparent burden of government doesn’t seem to be very solid grounds upon which to build an argument.

  22. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    Dude, you’ve got to get a better accountant. Dick Cheney paid less in tax than you did. In fact, he overpaid and got a refund of $51,463.

  23. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    Dude, you’ve got to get a better accountant. Dick Cheney paid less in tax than you did. In fact, he overpaid and got a refund of $51,463.

    I must have had a better year than him.

  24. You’re right Tony, you don’t really know what any of us make, what we do, how much we take from the government or how much we give back. So speculating that we’re liberals simply because we don’t feel the apparent burden of government doesn’t seem to be very solid grounds upon which to build an argument.

    Well, a quick click-through to your blog informed me that you are working on a never ending dissertation of some sort – commendable, but I would guess that you eat more in taxes than you pay, and would like some more yet.

    So lets get to it – kids say “multi-colored giant lollypops for all” is terrific policy – then you get your first paycheck, and realize that someone has to pay for all of those lollypops, and you are someone, and your whole perspective on shit changes.

  25. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    Jesus, do you ever need a better accountant. And a tax attorney.

    Some conservative you are. Taxes are for the little people, Tony.

  26. Mmm I love that patronizing, paternalistic bit of “conventional wisdom” about old selfish bigots being smarter than the rest of us. Thanks for sharing!

  27. A we really treating it as good news that less than half of young people support “marriage equality”?

    Surely by now marriage equality should be the default philosophical position, claiming to believe in anything else should be an abberation, and the arguments should all be about how to make it happen in practice.

    Imagine coming right out and saying you believe in marriage inequality! I find that statistic profoundly depressing.

  28. I am really interested in how that money is being spent or wasted, because apparently I’m in a one way partnership with the government.

    Yes, I’m sure you receive no benefits from the government whatsoever. Maintained roads, emergency services, getting to live in a city where everyone has had some degree of education and therefore can handle the responsibilities of their service jobs doing your dry cleaning and giving you proper change while checking you out at the store.

    I’ve always thought the opposite – people are conservative when they’re young and selfish, and become liberal when (if) they start to notice that other people exist.

  29. Orlando– the people who are against it don’t see it in terms of equality v. inequality (and I bet you anything it’s not phrased that way in the polls either– “gay marriage” is the term in most of the tv, etc discourse) I live in a conservative part of the country, and was actually surprised that that many supported it. Sadly, homophobia, and the sense that one’s specific religious beliefs should set standards for the rest of the world are still pretty deeply entrenched in places like this (and many others).

  30. …because apparently I’m in a one way partnership with the government.

    Have you, any member of your family, or anyone that know and care about ever:
    – attended public school?
    – taken classes at a state or community college?
    – asked for or required the assitance of a police officer?
    – been helped by a firefighter or other rescue worker?
    – joined the military?
    – put trash out on a curb or in a dumpter to be collected?
    – had your roads plowed on a snowy day?
    – had the roads that drive on repaired?
    – relied on a dam to protect you from flooding?
    – received a pension after retiring from a government job?
    – played on a playground?
    – visited a city, state, or national park?
    – used an accessibility ramp?
    – been vacinated against disease?
    – enjoyed a college or community theater concert/stage production?
    – gotten a driver’s license?
    – flown on an airplane, for business or for pleasure?
    – used a train, bus, streetcar, or other mode of public transportation?
    – exercised your right to vote? (Hey, those electronic machines and paper ballots don’t magically appear out of nowhere!)

    If you answered “yes” to any of the above, then no, sir, you are not in a one-way partnership with the government.

    And if you’re really curious as to how your tax money is being spent, well, you can find that information with about five seconds’ worth of googling. Which, I agree, is a GOOD thing to be concerned about. For example, I wish that Uncle Sam would spend less of my tax money developing experimental fighter jets and more of my tax money on medical benefits for war veterans. But if you wanna change that, then the way to go about is not kvetching about how much you have to pay in the first place.

  31. Oh, come on, guys. Lay off Tony. With a salary like that, he’s obviously a public school teache– oh. Well, he must be an ER nurse. Oh, I know, maybe he’s an activist with ACORN, combating inner-city housing disparities.

    Tony, you don’t know from a one-way partnership.

  32. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    Jesus, do you ever need a better accountant. And a tax attorney.

    Some conservative you are. Taxes are for the little people, Tony.

    I actually have an LL.M. in federal taxation – even though it is not my practice area – and there really isn’t any way to minimize my taxable income outside of asking for a lower salary or cheating. I don’t think that my firm would help me cheat, so here we are. Keep in mind that I am still in my twenties, and am

    making

    money, rather than moving around capital assets, in which case my effective rate of tax would indeed be lower.

    car Says:

    I am really interested in how that money is being spent or wasted, because apparently I’m in a one way partnership with the government.

    Yes, I’m sure you receive no benefits from the government whatsoever. Maintained roads, emergency services, getting to live in a city where everyone has had some degree of education and therefore can handle the responsibilities of their service jobs doing your dry cleaning and giving you proper change while checking you out at the store.

    I’ve always thought the opposite – people are conservative when they’re young and selfish, and become liberal when (if) they start to notice that other people exist.

    Yeah, I don’t think that I use 74K worth of services. And my experience thus far has been that despite exponentially increased spending on education, my change is still wrong quite often. Hit a nasty pothole yesterday too.

    Mmm I love that patronizing, paternalistic bit of “conventional wisdom” about old selfish bigots being smarter than the rest of us. Thanks for sharing!

    Well, it is kind of the inverse of “cool young people are liberals,” which is equally patronizing. Help me out with the bigotry part here . . .

  33. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    Ah, yes. That reminds me of something my grandmother used to say, usually about friends she had grown up with during the Depression:

    “Sure, now their bellies are full, they’ve become conservatives.”

  34. Actually, you know what I find interesting about that statement? It means that you have 74K to spare, and can live quite adequately on what you have left. That pretty much kills any sympathy I might have for your plight.

    I suppose that the history of progressive blue-bloods in this country, the slew of people in Europe who pay much higher taxes, proportionally, but are consistently more left-liberal, just don’t exist. Because they would totally blow your simplistic little justification.

  35. Yeah but just wait till the next batch of Quiverfull babies grow up. I have a nasty feeling this is only a temporary thing, something about the insane birthrate of the other side.

    I bet that way more than half of those Quiverfull babies will rebel like crazy. After all, how do you think *I* got here? I’m one of 10!

  36. I actually have an LL.M. in federal taxation

    Most decent programs don’t just give the LLM in federal taxation.

  37. I actually have an LL.M. in federal taxation

    Most decent programs don’t just give the LLM in federal taxation.

  38. Actually, you know what I find interesting about that statement? It means that you have 74K to spare, and can live quite adequately on what you have left. That pretty much kills any sympathy I might have for your plight.

    I suppose that the history of progressive blue-bloods in this country, the slew of people in Europe who pay much higher taxes, proportionally, but are consistently more left-liberal, just don’t exist. Because they would totally blow your simplistic little justification.

    Well, I’m so glad that you see fit that I get to keep some of what I earn. I’m alive, therefore the double “progressive” tax regime is fair and proper. Thanks a bunch. Being the first college educated in my family, I don’t suppose you would think it proper for me to keep a little extra, you know, so my kids can compete with those blue bloods?

    I guess a degree in the gender dynamics of the Tagalog might not have prepared you to understand the difference between wages and return on capital, the bluebloods having a good bit of the latter, taxed at 15% as it is. More power to ’em, I say. They also wouldn’t have lobbied for those neat little IRC provisions for nonrecognition and deferred realization and such, so that they would remain wealthy, huh? Maybe you’re a bit over your head here, sizzlechest.

  39. I actually have an LL.M. in federal taxation

    Most decent programs don’t just give the LLM in federal taxation.

    You know, I might have taken offense if I thought you really knew what an LL.M. was, or if I thought that you knew that 95% of LL.M. students are post-graduates, having already earned a J.D. from another institution. Yeah, might.

    Try again, while I fondle your petals.

  40. Most decent programs don’t just give the LLM in federal taxation.

    Yeah, only the TTTs, right?

    Anyway, I think there’s some common ground here that’s being missed. Tony’s got a problem with the nation’s regressive tax structure when it comes to wages vs. capital. Warren Buffet had a lot to say about it at a Clinton fundraiser on Tuesday:

    Buffett cited himself, the third-richest person in the world, as an example. Last year, Buffett said, he was taxed at 17.7 percent on his taxable income of more than $46 million. His receptionist was taxed at about 30 percent … And he challenged Congress and his audience to see what the people who “clean our offices” are taxed, to loud applause.

    That seems like a pretty fair position, no?

  41. I always heard the saying as “If you’re 20 and a conservative, you have no heart. If you’re 50 and a liberal, you have no money.”

  43. Point taken

    Heh, relax there, chief. I was ribbing Zuzu for being elitist, not you for being undereducated. I am thoroughly awed by your credentials.

  45. Point taken

    Heh, relax there, chief. I was ribbing Zuzu for being elitist, not you for being undereducated. I am thoroughly awed by your credentials.

    Wasn’t my point, as I didn’t go to NYU – Manhattan ain’t my bag, not enough New Yorkers.

  46. Tony, I pay real taxes, too — including the big Westchester property tax bill, and yet I don’t suck the cock of Corporate America. Nor do I live on somebody’s trust fund. My father came to this country with a trade school degree and a toolbox, and I drew a paycheck at 13 for swinging a hammer. Stop pretending that being a right wing asshole is a necessary and proper consequence of making money.

  47. And for a guy who brags about not having a blog because you have a job, we sure see you around a lot.

    Selling time is not my business model and my work flow varies widely. What’s your excuse?

  48. You know, I might have taken offense if I thought you really knew what an LL.M. was, or if I thought that you knew that 95% of LL.M. students are post-graduates, having already earned a J.D. from another institution. Yeah, might.

    Try again, while I fondle your petals.

    Aw, such a manly man, telling me that all I need is a good fucking to set me straight! And that you’re just the guy to do it. It’s a good thing you don’t go around murdering and raping and molesting people, ’cause that’s just the kind of guy you are.

    But Tony, you’re missing the point of my ribbing, which is underscored by your link to NYU’s LLM program: do you see “federal” taxation there as an option? No, just tax and international tax.

    Saying that you have an LLM in “federal taxation,” then…

    Perhaps you might reconsider taking offense.

  49. Also, I pay plenty in taxes myself, living in NYC and making good money. And there are an awful lot of other people in NYC paying high taxes and making good money.

    Shockingly, it’s one of the most liberal cities going. And we even pay out more in federal tax dollars than we get back, money that goes to pay the bills of red states.

    So, no, paying a high amount in taxes doesn’t automatically turn you into a conservative.

  50. Well, damn–I was a presidential scholar last year and none of us thought to do anything nearly this cool.

    Speaking of that experience (my most vivid memory of which involves staring at the three feet of water covering DC one night while someone joked with the boy from Louisiana who’d just read at a dinner an essay about his teacher who canoed people to safety during Katrina that we should call up his teacher to borrow his canoe), Mr. President gave us a speech about the value of diversity and the importance of keeping religion out of the federal government.

    No, really. He said that! With a straight face, no less. He told us he believed it was his duty to keep religion and government separate.

    We also had a marvelously Daily Show-esque moment in the Q&A session with the deputy secretary of defense:

    Presidential Scholar: You said that you believe one of the goals of the military is to spread democracy. How does that come into conflict with the fact that recent polls indicate that the majority of Iraqis favor immediate withdrawal of US troos?
    Deputy Secretary of Defense: Well, [blabla something military is noble service blabla something something totally not answering the question.]
    Presidential Scholar: …Right, but… How does that come into conflict with the fact that recent polls indicate that the majority of Iraqis favor immediate withdrawal of US troos?
    Deputy Secretary of Defense: I don’t believe the polls say that.
    Presidential Scholar: ……….Really?

  51. I was ribbing Zuzu for being elitist

    Hey, I’m not the one throwing around my faux-credentials and tax burden to impress everyone.

  52. Let’s see, you pay $74k in taxes. Now, let’s assume for a moment–because i’m lazy as hell and don’t want to do too much math–that the system isn’t actually progressive, and you pay the same flat rate for all of your taxable income, which would probably be 33%. That means that you make, at minimum, about $225k per year just in taxable income. That means that after taxes, you have at minimum (*checks calculator*) $151k.

    But of course, you actually have more than that because you don’t pay 33% on all of your income, just your income over about $160k. And, if you’re in your 20s as you say, you’re only going to make more money (assuming you stay with this particular career path). So please, take your griping about over-taxation to someplace that gives a shit.

  53. You know, I might have taken offense if I thought you really knew what an LL.M. was, or if I thought that you knew that 95% of LL.M. students are post-graduates, having already earned a J.D. from another institution. Yeah, might.

    Genius boy, zuzu has a J.D. As do many other commenters on this blog (Thomas and myself included).

    Get off your anguished pedestal already.

  54. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    CRAP. I paid 82k. Does this mean I have to be a conservative now? What’s the cut-off? I need to know how much my husband and I have to give back to our employers before we can go back to being people with rational opinions rather than politicos.

    Wait….does that make tax evaders liberal or conservative….

  55. Aw, such a manly man, telling me that all I need is a good fucking to set me straight! And that you’re just the guy to do it. It’s a good thing you don’t go around murdering and raping and molesting people, ‘cause that’s just the kind of guy you are.

    But Tony, you’re missing the point of my ribbing, which is underscored by your link to NYU’s LLM program: do you see “federal” taxation there as an option? No, just tax and international tax.

    Saying that you have an LLM in “federal taxation,” then…

    Perhaps you might reconsider taking offense.

    Except my “program” is listed as LL.M. in Tax, I only took one class in SALT, none in international Tax, so it is proper to call it an LL.M. in Federal Tax. I think, you know, that yours is a picayune trifle. Of course, I might think the real measure of any program would be the services rendered to the client after applying the knowledge gained.

    I don’t know what the fuck you look like, but I do know that you are wholly disagreeable, and take others’ political differences with you as a personal affront. I have, as of yet, no desire to give you the pleasure of my fucking you; “zuzu’s petals” were in George Bailey’s coat pocket, hence the phrase. Really, though, you are as irresistable as you think.

  57. Of course, I might think the real measure of any program would be the services rendered to the client after applying the knowledge gained.

    Well, since you said you don’t actually use it in your practice, I’d think that was a waste, hm?

  58. You know, I might have taken offense if I thought you really knew what an LL.M. was, or if I thought that you knew that 95% of LL.M. students are post-graduates, having already earned a J.D. from another institution. Yeah, might.

    Genius boy, zuzu has a J.D. As do many other commenters on this blog (Thomas and myself included).

    Get off your anguished pedestal already.

    Listen for a moment – hear that? It is the sound of me giving a fuck.

    If that’s the case, y’all must be transactional attorneys, cause you sure as fuck can’t argue worth a shit.

  59. Of course, I might think the real measure of any program would be the services rendered to the client after applying the knowledge gained.

    Well, since you said you don’t actually use it in your practice, I’d think that was a waste, hm?

    Probably so, unless I want to migrate over to the transactional side, in which case not.

    Knowledge is powa!

  60. If that’s the case, y’all must be transactional attorneys, cause you sure as fuck can’t argue worth a shit.

    Um, sure thing, Tax Boy.

  61. If that’s the case, y’all must be transactional attorneys, cause you sure as fuck can’t argue worth a shit.

    Um, sure thing, Tax Boy.

    Excellent retort, counselor. Can’t you just go all Marcotte on me and accuse me of every rape since Leda and ban me already? ‘Cause this is getting trite.

  62. Let’s see, you pay $74k in taxes. Now, let’s assume for a moment–because i’m lazy as hell and don’t want to do too much math–that the system isn’t actually progressive, and you pay the same flat rate for all of your taxable income, which would probably be 33%. That means that you make, at minimum, about $225k per year just in taxable income. That means that after taxes, you have at minimum (*checks calculator*) $151k.

    I’m guessing he makes considerably less than $225K, because you have to figure state, local and FICA taxes into the mix.

  63. I’m guessing he makes considerably less than $225K, because you have to figure state, local and FICA taxes into the mix.

    Good show. Back on track, as it were.

  64. Can’t you just go all Marcotte on me and accuse me of every rape since Leda and ban me already? ‘Cause this is getting trite.

    I don’t work here anymore.

    Though it would explain a whole lot that you got your ass banned from Pandagon, probably for making charming little statements like “I’ll keep fondling your petals” and the like.

  65. Good show. Back on track, as it were.

    Not really, because your existential whine about how much money the government is taking for Those Other People But Somehow Not You or Even Your Cop Family was a derail, and an extended troll.

    I shouldn’t be feeding the troll, honestly, but I have some downtime today.

  66. Yeah but just wait till the next batch of Quiverfull babies grow up. I have a nasty feeling this is only a temporary thing, something about the insane birthrate of the other side.

    My next-door neighbors aren’t Quiverfull, but they have ten kids at present (Catholic), and recently I encountered the oldest dealing with multiple younger-kid-related problems at once and chanting under her breath, “Only two kids, only two kids, only two kids.”

    Yeah, I’m guessing that there’s gonna be a lot of them that run as soon as they turn eighteen. That, of course, is half the reason they fight so tooth-and-nail against mainline society and “secularism.” They can’t be happy having their daughters able to access knowledge that there’s another world for them where they don’t have to do all that shit.

  67. oh boy, another round of tier-wanking. it’s like talking to an AutoAdmit asshole, except this one’s all growed up and aware of how to use SpellCheck. “sizzlechest”. the fuck?

    so, tony: you are the first in your family to go to college. bully for you. did you pay your own way outright, or did you get a few grants and loans to finance all that Prestige? tax dollars go to financing that sort of thing, you know. well, they used to, at least; given that my household income was under $25K last year and i still didn’t qualify for a Pell Grant, i assume they’ve yanked a bit of funding for that.

    even if you are just so stellarly supremely awesome that the country’s law schools tripped over their own erect cocks in their heated frenzy to lure you to their hallowed halls, paying your way entirely, you probably still had the benefit of a public school education, somewhere along the line. once again, Your Tax Dollars At Work.

  68. I’m guessing he makes considerably less than $225K, because you have to figure state, local and FICA taxes into the mix.

    Oh right. That’s what i get for forgetting that there’s no place like Texas (no state or local income taxes here, not that it does us any good). Apologies.

    Excellent retort, counselor. Can’t you just go all Marcotte on me and accuse me of every rape since Leda and ban me already? ‘Cause this is getting trite.

    Lemieux’s Law I is proven again.

  69. Can’t you just go all Marcotte on me and accuse me of every rape since Leda and ban me already? ‘Cause this is getting trite.

    I don’t work here anymore.

    Though it would explain a whole lot that you got your ass banned from Pandagon, probably for making charming little statements like “I’ll keep fondling your petals” and the like.

    Yeah, because she’s not ban-happy or anything, and you never get the least bit crude or indelicate. You bore me. Shouldn’t you be springing Pakistani throat cutters from Guantanimo or something?

  70. also, tony, just so you know: you don’t have to be banned in order to leave. see that X in the corner of your browser window? you can click it, and just not come back again! it’s like having the power to BAN YOURSELF, and it saves you the time of banging out weird jimmy-stewart-inspired sexualised threats.

  71. But if he leaves of his own accord, kidlacan, how can he moan about the eeeeeevil feminazis who banned him because he spoke THE TRUTH and they can’t handle THE TRUTH!

  73. I am constantly amazed at the amount of time and energy that some creeps devote to getting banned from places so they can feel persecuted.

    Because it’s such an outrage to not be welcome in a space one has intruded upon to interrupt and disrupt constructive discussions between peers. I’m sure I’d be welcome in any board room with an anti-capitalism rant, but these feminists, they’re just going too far in wanting to discuss things amongst themselves!

  74. also, tony, just so you know: you don’t have to be banned in order to leave. see that X in the corner of your browser window? you can click it, and just not come back again! it’s like having the power to BAN YOURSELF, and it saves you the time of banging out weird jimmy-stewart-inspired sexualised threats.

    And what is the sport in that? This whole magilla went from one possibly constuctive discussion in which I pointed out that an oppressive tax burden has the tendency to disabuse young people of some of their more leftist political views to an oh so embarrassing discussion about LL.M. programs in Tax, which I guess was supposed to hurt my feelings or something. Round after round of people telling me all about my life and times who don’t know me, all becuase I’m not all pumped up about someone else spending so much of what I earn? The thing is, if the public services that I used actually worked well, you could make a more convincing argument.

    Oh well if the whole tone of this blog is degrees of adherence to feministe dogma, and competition to snark the fundie, maybe I will ban myself. But don’t feel all Supreme and such, cause zuzu brought it weak. At least Jill engaged, you know, some ideas while calling me racist.

  75. whee! it’s the world of Internets, where “speaking truth to power” = “indirect class-baiting paired with astounding levels of whiny-ass entitlement”! where expressing irritation with some random stompy asshole’s tedious attention-whoring makes you A TERRORIST LOVING FACIST COMMUNIST WITH HAIRY LEGS! where up is down and black is white and cats and dogs live togethe!

  76. he spoke THE TRUTH

    Indeed.

    Don’t you sometimes wish you had a production team so that when crap like this comes up you could push a button on your desk and say “Bob, could you cue up that rant on: Empathy – Expanding Your Reality. Thanks.”

  77. I have serious doubts that you ever actually had liberal ideals. If you did, it sure didn’t take much to kill them.

    Sorry, i’ll stop feeding the troll now…

  78. The thing is, if the public services that I used actually worked well, you could make a more convincing argument.

    Your food is safe to eat, your streets are paved, your garbage is picked up, your relatives are employed as cops, you yourself were in the military, public schools overall perform quite well, thank you, snow gets removed, highways get maintained, you undoubtedly got some kind of assistance to go to school, you can take drugs with a good degree of confidence that they’ll do what they say they do and are generally safe, you use technology every day that was developed by or for the government (like, duh, the internet), and you’ve got the nerve to say that your public services don’t work well?

    Forgive me if I don’t cry you a river that you pay your fair share in taxes.

  79. Forgive me if I don’t cry you a river that you pay your fair share in taxes.

    You left out the free stuff for other people who don’t work part. All of the listed services serve all equally, and my stakes being somewhat higher (as to, say, property crime) I can accept that I must pay more for Law Enforcement. Fair enough.

    But it begs the question, what is a “fair share” as a ceiling percentage of anyone’s income?

    I need to eat now.

  80. tony, the discussion stopped being “constructive” when you started bitching about how all of the people in america using public services were showing insufficient gratitude to you for paying your damn income taxes. which was, you know, the topic of your first post. what did you expect? oh, right. you expected “sport”, not discussion. odd hobby, feeling persecuted, but i guess it’s cheaper than paying greens fees or owning a boat. which you probably just can’t afford to do any more, what with those hypothetical leeches in detroit who have the nerve to keep sponging off you.

    the thing is, tony, that if people like you didn’t bitch and moan so much about your precious fucking taxable income, public services would work better. happens in plenty of countries all the world over. but clear-eyed, wise-headed conservatives like you vote with their wallets, and so we get incompetent government. your tax dollars — and mine — get pissed away through shitty management, and none of us see the full benefit.

  81. I figure I am raising two families, maybe one in Appalachia, maybe one in Detroit. Neither have the courtesy to send a Christmas card.

    Folks, shouldn’t a hat be passed around for his 2008 taxes??? Or else he may end up in the same boat as those people who don’t even have stamps to send Tony his deserved Christmas card.

    Happy Holidays!!

  82. How the hell would I know what “any of you” make anyway? And I guess there won’t be much bellyaching that I “don’t pay my fair share?”

    Well, if your assumptions about what makes a liberal and what makes a conservative are correct, wouldn’t you just conclude that we’re all lower-class idiots without jobs? Or are liberals the overeducated Massachusetts elitists? I can never remember.

    And I’d gladly pay more taxes than I already do if I knew the money would be used wisely, in programs that help people. ‘Cause you see, it benefits me to live in a relatively peaceful, prosperous society that runs smoothly.

    Taxes are an INVESTMENT. Are you so short-sighted that you can’t recognize that you’re a member of a community? Let me guess, taxes are OK as long as they only pay for “essential” services (i.e. the ones YOU use).

  83. First, Tony: You used the phrase “begs the question” improperly.

    Second: So you’re sad that you’re not on Medicaid or food stamps? Boo hoo. Those greedy little old ladies shouldn’t be using your tax money to fund their Disability checks. Newsflash: Should misfortune befall you, you can get Disability too.

  84. Why are we feeding the trolls?

    I mean can’t we just pat Tony on the head for being a poor widdle credentialed, o’er burdened, o’er taxed, unappreciated master of creation whose very impressive professional credentials and income apparently leave him lots of time to troll feminist blogs and who apparently lacks sufficient creativity to come up with anything more productive to do with all that highly-remunerated leisure time and therefore needs cosseting and head-patting by the readers of those self-same feminist blogs, because he’s just soooo highly taxed?

    Having paid Tony his due can we then talk about something interesting, like, say the awesomeness of those Presidential Scholars?

  85. How much of the polling result is due to the growing negative reaction against the actions of the current administration regarding war, Civil liberties, and the Republican party’s increasingly closeness to the religious right?

    Moreover, why is it that so much American political discourse is framed in a simplistic dichotomy of “liberal vs. conservative” or “conservative vs liberal”? Aren’t there many Americans whose political views are more diverse and complex are such that they do not totally conform to one of those two categories?

    It is also amusing how the term “liberal” can have many different connotations in political discourse depending on the nation and historical context.

    One amusing example:

    In The Liberals

  86. You left out the free stuff for other people who don’t work part.

    Right. How dare we exhibit any compassion for or provide any assistance to people who are unemployed. The tragedy that is SSI!

    Also, most of the programs I suspect you’re whining about about supporting are available to people who do work full time and just don’t make enough to cover the bills.

  87. But it begs the question, what is a “fair share” as a ceiling percentage of anyone’s income?

    A “fair share” is relative simple in concept. An amount that equalizes the tax burden taking into consideration the diminishing marginal utility of wealth. (A dollar to a man struggling to raise two kids on minimum wage is far more “valuable” than the same dollar I waste at Starbucks rather than the local coffee house).

    In practice its damn hard to structure a system that works to achieve this concept, but I think most rational people can agree that wealthy people should pay significantly more taxes as a percentage of income than the poor and somewhat more in taxes as a percentage of income than the middle-class.

    Reagan (*shudder*) may have thought lower taxes were better for the economy…but I don’t think anyone has rationally made the argument that they were more “fair”.

  88. Ignoring all the troll stuff just to say: that story about the students’ letter to Bush made my morning better. Thank you.

  89. Having paid Tony his due can we then talk about something interesting, like, say the awesomeness of those Presidential Scholars?

    Yes! It kind of makes me wish i was smarter, and more achievement-like when i was in high school. Those kids are now pretty much my heroes.

    I wrote Facebook messages to a couple of them who were on CNN on Tuesday (i think it was Tuesday). I hope that wasn’t too weird, but i wanted to express appreciation somehow, and that seemed like a good idea.

  90. You left out the free stuff for other people who don’t work part.

    Because none of the other economically sophisticated Western democracies with high standards of living have welfare states …

  91. Exholt, our political system structurally rewards only two parties, and so all American politics tends to resolve to a single-axis approach. There are people who are populist or libertarian, but they basically have to choose to either opt out of the political spectrum or make alliances that privilege some of their views over others.

  92. Strange, I keep getting more liberal as I get older, even though I had to pay more taxes IN this year after doing said forms. Maybe it has to do with having been on food stamps for a year or two. Maybe it has to do with understanding what happens in families (like the one I grew up in) where insurance is an impossibility due to factors like age, existing health status, and oh, being self-employed (can’t afford the premiums). Maybe it has to do with the fact that I live in the Midwest, in a freaking *bread basket*, and kids in my city still go to bed hungry.

    Yeah, there are people that abuse the system. There just always will be — deal with it. And I agree most emphatically that we need to keep an eye on what the government is spending our taxes on. (Not that it does a whole lot of good most of the time. But if we directed our energy at our representatives instead of random ranting, that might change. Maybe. I’m feeling optimistic today.) But cutting taxes, while it does get more money into people’s pockets, does nothing for keeping the infrastructure we’ve come to rely on going, let alone keep people from falling into the abyss of poverty. And yeah, I think that at this stage of the game, with the ridiculous consumerism around us (and I’m talking middle class consumerism, not just the really over the top stuff) — at this stage of the game I really do think that no one in this country should have to go to bed hungry. At minimum.

    I think I’ll keep my liberal thought processes, thanks. After all, I have enough STUFF in my life, especially compared with some people out there. In fact, we need to go through our house and get rid of stuff that we don’t really need. I have a decent house in a good neighborhood. I eat well regularly without having to worry about it. My car isn’t going to die unexpectedly, and I can go to the doctor if I get sick. I can dress presentably for most situations, so even if my business fails catastrophically, I can find a job. I have enough *skills* to find another job if I need to. I’m fucking RICH.

  93. Also, most of the programs I suspect you’re whining about about supporting are available to people who do work full time and just don’t make enough to cover the bills.

    Like members of the military. Or Wal-Mart employees.

    Also: no, people who receive public assistance don’t actually get the same level of services that the wealthier do. Potholes in my part of town get fixed, but in poor neighborhoods, they don’t. 911 for me is a quick service. Not so much in East New York. Same with the local schools, which vary widely in quality, but in general, those that function best are in wealthy areas of town and those that function worst are in the poor sections of town. Same school system, same pool of money, different resource allocation.

    In any event, Tony, social welfare programs make up only a tiny fraction of the tax budget. More money has gone to pay Halliburton to serve rotten food to soldiers than goes to food stamps. More money has gone to finance obsolete and unnecessary weapons systems than has gone for health care for poor kids.

    Social welfare’s the bargain. It’s the corporate welfare that’s bleeding your wallet dry.

  94. I’ve always wondered if the people who respond that they think there should be more restrictions on abortion actually know what the restrictions are. Most people I have met believe the anti-choice propaganda that one is free to walk into the nearest clinic (which is always 5 min away, at most) and come out in 20 minutes having aborted your 9 month old fetus for $50.

    I bet if the surveys put a list of the restrictions that are currently in place in most jurisdictions in front of the person answering the survey and THEN asked, “Should there be more restrictions?” most pro-choice people would say no.

  95. More money has gone to finance obsolete and unnecessary weapons systems than has gone for health care for poor kids.

    Emphasis on kids. Why do you hate babies, Tony? When programs are cut, guess who the easiest targets are? Kids and the elderly. It’s not deadbeats who benefit from the foster care system – it’s children (and even they don’t benefit half the time; social workers have such impossible caseloads). SCHIP isn’t for cheats and scammers – it’s for children’s healthcare. For chrissakes. Such a pitiful amount of tax money even goes to social welfare programs; it’s really low of you to complain.

  96. As the saying goes ” . . . until the first paycheck . . . ”

    That pesky witholding statement on my paystub sets me right straight every two weeks.

    I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    That would make your income pretty high. Excuse me if I don’t shed a tear for you.

    Oh, and at my current job I’m being taxed in the highest tax bracket, so about a third of each paycheck goes to federal, state and city taxes. Does it suck? Yes. Do I then remember that I enjoy walking and driving down paved roads, commuting using a working subway system, having an adequate police force, and having emergency health care if I need it? Yes. Is it ok with me to be taxed at a higher rate, given that I’m making a stupid amount of money for what I’m doing? Yes. Am I ok with being taxed if it means that a kid somewhere (in Detroit or the Appalacians or in a Mormon community in Utah or down the street from me or anywhere) will go to bed with a full stomach tonight? Absolutely.

  97. Emphasis on kids. Why do you hate babies, Tony? When programs are cut, guess who the easiest targets are? Kids and the elderly.

    If Tony is true to his cliche image, he probably LOVES the fetus, but HATES the baby.

    And as far as the elderly are concerned, are there no Debtor’s Prisons anymore? Besides, if you make those kids start working in the factories right away, they won’t live long enough to become “elderly”.

    Hey, it worked for Dickens’ England…

  98. I bet if the surveys put a list of the restrictions that are currently in place in most jurisdictions in front of the person answering the survey and THEN asked, “Should there be more restrictions?” most pro-choice people would say no.

    Excellent point.

  99. Off-topic, but another bit of good news.

    Us Brits are finally shot of Blair the Thatcherite! It may mean putting up with Gordy Brown but we’ll get an election in a year!

    Yay! *dances*

  100. What a “fair share” is in terms of taxation is, like most things in a democracy, determined by political and social negotiation and renegotiation. Taxes are the price we pay for civilization.

    I also am the first in my family to have a college degree of any sort, let alone graduate degrees (have one, working on another). Yeah, my own achievements had a lot to do with that, but I got a lot of help, without which what I did achieve would have been much more difficult, if it were possible at all. When the economy was in the toilet in the early 1980s, I definitely appreicated (even at a then-young age) the assistance my family got. Given what my family has contributed since then, it was not wasted.

    As for the whole, “you get more conservative when you get older” thing, Denis Diderot had something to say about that.

  101. Yes Bunny, I saw the coverage of TB leaving 10 Downing. My husband and I got into watching C-SPAN’s coverage of Parliment (and Canada’s as well) for awhile; would have loved to have seen our pres in the same sort of format with Congress.

    I don’t really know that much about Gordy Brown- how screwed are you folks as compared to the previous situation with Blair? Will read up and get myself up to speed…

  102. In any event, Tony, social welfare programs make up only a tiny fraction of the tax budget. More money has gone to pay Halliburton to serve rotten food to soldiers than goes to food stamps. More money has gone to finance obsolete and unnecessary weapons systems than has gone for health care for poor kids.

    Social welfare’s the bargain. It’s the corporate welfare that’s bleeding your wallet dry.

    Thank you for pointing this out, it bears repeating.

    I wholeheartedly agree that the government should be fiscally responsible with our money. I can entertain arguments against progressive taxation. I can entertain discussions on what the government should and should not use taxes to fund.

    But for fuck’s sake, drop the “OMG! TEH LAZY WELFARE QUEENS R TAKIN ALL MY MONEIES!” shtick. Someone that was really interested in establishing fiscal responsibility and figuring out where your money is going would have figured out by now that of all the crap your government wastes money on, the amount that social welfare gets is pretty low on the ladder.

    But please, don’t let that stop you from supporting the party that has wasted billions of dollars on things like the racist war on drugs, American imperialism, the ever-so-profitable military industrial prison complex, corporate welfare for those companies whose CEOs seem to think it’s not necessary for them to fund their own damn business costs with their yearly bonuses, pork-laden bills that Dear Leader refuses time and time again to veto, and undisclosed earmarks that conservatives are overwhelmingly in favor of keeping secret.

    Naw, you just keep telling yourself that the “Tax and Spend Liberals” tripe is totally accurate if you just plug you ears and keep screaming it over, and over, and over again.

  103. It’s kinda hard to tell whether he’s going to be any good at all. He’s trying to distance himself from Blair and hinting that he’s going to do things differently (he started doing that after Labour realised how much the electorate hated Blair) but it’s unclear if he actually means it based on his track record.

    If I steal a phrase from my all-time favourite book, “Is it Just Me or is Everything Shit? Volume One”, because this phrase sums it up pretty well.

    If we believe the script, he’s ready and willing to redirect us to the Promised Land… This is, after all, the man who claimed that Labour is “best when we are Labour”, a coded message to the disillusioned hordes meaning: “come to daddy”. But if Labour is best when its Labour, presumably Labour is not at its best when it’s doing things like: promising the CBI a “light touch” on workplace health and safety inspections; or siding with employers against unions in having people work more hours a week than they are likely to sleep; or letting public sector workforces be subsumed by privatised McJobs, or relaunching the system of PFI, which means your local hospital wing is built by the same company that does school meals in Baghdad and nothing works quite right because everything’s done on the shit…So who’s letting the side down all those times? Two clues: he’s Chancellor of the Exchequer and he’s called Gordon.

    Notwithstanding that if even a needy, grasping hateful creature like Cherie Blair hates him he must be a complete twerp.

  105. norbizness Says:
    June 28th, 2007 at 4:18 pm
    Apparently the downtime had the effect of resetting the conventional wisdom about feeding trolls.

    I clicked through to your blog, and the creepy wormhole of the Universe struck me, as my uncle was a member of the 1976 Flyers “The Broad Street Bullies.” The men in the picture are, R to L Jimmy Watson, Don Salieski, and Orest Kindrachuck. Don’t know whether you are interested, but so it goes.

  107. If you have a job, Tony Palmyra, at which you make lots and lots of money, how is it that you can comment on feminists blogs (when you’re not even a feminist!)? Yeah, I clicked on your name and laughed at the suggestion that since some of us have blogs we mustn’t have jobs. The two are not mutually exclusive.

    Anyway, what’s your secret? What sort of work do you do where you can spend time trolling feminist blogs while raking in serious dough?

  108. If you have a job, Tony Palmyra, at which you make lots and lots of money, how is it that you can comment on feminists blogs (when you’re not even a feminist!)? Yeah, I clicked on your name and laughed at the suggestion that since some of us have blogs we mustn’t have jobs. The two are not mutually exclusive.

    Anyway, what’s your secret? What sort of work do you do where you can spend time trolling feminist blogs while raking in serious dough?

    I’m drafting a Brief right now, so when I got a bit bored I looked at this blog for something to do. No matter, I’ll probably be in the same place ’till 8 or 9, really until it gets done. (Psst . . . the secret is Ephedra, a.ka. Ma Huang) Also, in litigation, things ebb and flow, its kind of quiet for two weeks or so, Judges like their vacations, don’t you know.

    Query – does disagreeing with the prevailing sentiment make me a troll? You ought never accuse others of only wanting to hear their own opinions after your treatment of me here.

    It might not have occurred to you, but I know that authentic representations of my opinions and beliefs aren’t made in the MSM, and I figured that the same might be true of feminists, with whom I disagree, but I might still like to see what the opinions actually are – so that at the very least I could disagree with the authentic opinions, instead of what the media serves. Like “hey, thery’re crazy, but they don’t believe X, it is really Y, still crazy, but whatta you gonna do?” Some people might consider that an attempt to learn, become wiser, etc., but I guess its easier to call me a troll and make ineffective snark. Why this blog? Well, the tone is a bit more civil than the other ones, which is probably set by the less-than-super-angry Jill, who has actually been *decent* to me, racist comment notwithstanding. That is, you know, different than the stereotype, but then again she might be the world’s only committed but non-angry feminist – I don’t know, but judging by the comments she is a rare bird indeed. (*I know that many of you probably think that everyone, including yourselves, are racist and it is a matter of recognizing this fact, so no biggie*)

  109. Query – does disagreeing with the prevailing sentiment make me a troll?

    No, dear. But being a racist, misogynist, condescending asshole who assumes nobody here has a job? That could do it.

  110. It might not have occurred to you, but I know that authentic representations of my opinions and beliefs aren’t made in the MSM

    I thought that was why Fox existed.

  111. Where to begin…

    People are calling you a troll because you’ve entered a feminist space with a really condescending and disrespectful anti-feminist attutide. Get off your high horse.

    Has it ever occured to you that feminists have good reason to be angry? And that if you make it a habit to go to their blogs to mock them you might not be handled with care?

    Everyone’s a racist. Everyone. Some of us are anti-racism racists though.

    Have you even read any of the recent posts about, you know, taxes?

  112. Query – does disagreeing with the prevailing sentiment make me a troll?

    No, dear. But being a racist, misogynist, condescending asshole who assumes nobody here has a job? That could do it.

    Is that foreplay? A’cause it sure sounds like it.

    Racist, misogynist, (forgot homophobe) asshole (guilty of being an asshole). Check. Add “elitist but his LL.M. leaves something to be desired.” What would you suggest that I do to unfuck myself at this point? I seem pretty irredeemable given your assessment.

    As for condescending – that would be a matter of judging which of us is the blacker kettle, although your condescention never really had the intended effect.

    I never assumed nobody has a job – you assumed that the same is what I assumed, because you find it great fun, I suppose. Don’t you usually go “Shorter Tony: nobody but me has a job.”

    My point was, right or wrong, the wage statement changes opinions – you may think it hardens hearts, I may think it a reality check, but the effect tends to be pretty clear.

    I’d only like to point out that plenty of people who want more stuff from the gub’mint seem to spend an awful lot of time every day blogging. I’d love to have a super-duper blog with my picture all over it, and tons of neat-o stuff, and all of my really important thoughts, but I never seem to get around to it. I probably could have in Law School, but not now.

    Can I play Karnak for a moment and guess that you’re not a full-time blogger here anymore because the Lawyering takes up a good deal of your waking hours?

    A second guess would be that you probably have 150K of law school debt, give or take, and you worked relatively hard for 3 plus years, and then in practice, to get to the point where you are. I think you deserve whatever you make, and maybe more, whether all the others who didn’t do all that hard stuff are jealous of you or not.

    Do recall, I know what 12-13 weeks of “intesive motivational adjustment” can do to a lad, former incompetent, now and forever squared away, so I do not weep for the hungry but able-bodied. Human potential is a thing to see in full, zuzu.

  113. My next-door neighbors aren’t Quiverfull, but they have ten kids at present (Catholic), and recently I encountered the oldest dealing with multiple younger-kid-related problems at once and chanting under her breath, “Only two kids, only two kids, only two kids.”

    LOL! Sorry. I’m one of eleven and there are two different reactions to being of such a large clan – to have no kids at all, or to continue procreating like it’s goin’ out of style. I love kids, but no WAY am I having any.

    They make big families look like so much FUN on TV and in the movies. And I think if I hadn’t grown up po’, it could have been a barrel of laughs. I do have many fond memories. I never really knew that some of what my family had to do to survive wasn’t, generally speaking, normal. What do you mean not everyone has to share a room with four sisters? Pffft, come on! In the long run, though, I would not recommend having a bazillion kids.

    Mind-bogglingly, my dirt poor parents have been and always will vote conservative. They’re issues voters, as in they vote on the issues I tend to think government should have a lesser say in, like abortion.

    I also want to mention that it’s perfectly possible to live conservatively and still hold liberal ideals, and you can do this at any age.

  114. Also, most of the programs I suspect you’re whining about about supporting are available to people who do work full time and just don’t make enough to cover the bills.

    Yes, THANK YOU. It pisses me off when people forget this.

    For an extreme example: I spent a year working for AmeriCorps, subsisting on a stipend that broke down to $3/hour. All of that went straight to rent and medical bills. Without food stamps, I would have starved to death. Free stuff for people who don’t work? Fucking please. Oh, and speaking of a one-way partnership with the government…. Putting in seventy hours a week for $3/hour? Yeah, I’d say that counts. Only the experience was AWESOME and one of the best years of my life, so you won’t see me complaining. 😉 And that’s just my story. Most everyone I know has needed food stamps or other welfare assistance at some point. And all of them were working full-time.

    And Tony, the reason that this thread’s discourse has descended into wanking about your educational credentials is because that’s the only point that you keep responding to. While conveniently avoiding all of the comments about, you know, how taxes actually work, and how your complaints are full of shit. If you’re like the average 100-200K income bracket member, then only 1% of your taxes go to social welfare anyway. So what are you complaining about?

  116. That is, you know, different than the stereotype, but then again she might be the world’s only committed but non-angry feminist – I don’t know, but judging by the comments she is a rare bird indeed.

    The sample size at a blog like this – as good a blog as it is – is far too small to make that kind of judgement.

    And as for anger, it seems to me that anger is an entirely appropriate response if one perceives injustice/inequality/etc. What one does with that anger is another question. If it’s employed, for example, to generate discussions such as those we find on this blog, I can’t really complain.

  117. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    QQ more. Nobody gives a shit that you had to get the 30ft yacht instead of the 50ft yacht.

  118. An old saying: If you are not liberal when you are young you have no heart. If you are not conservative when you are old you have no brain.

    And if you are a neocon you have neither.

  119. I have been reading the past couple of days the “Tale of Tony Palmyra”. It’s a story of some wealthy lawyer who goes to feminist blogs in his spare time and rants about all the injustices he must suffer everyday. A strange story.

    Thing is, he seems oddly attracted to these “liberals” and has gone to other sites in the past. But here he engages in crude sexual banter and appears to be confused why that meets with such hostility. He even complains of the lack of rational debate when the truth is he has no interest in that at all. He is here because he enjoys the sexual titillation. The notion that he is seeking to understand and have a polite talk with equals is just the lie he tells himself to be here.

    Of course, Tony gives as good as he gets and boy does he! And truth be told neither Tony nor his new friends are blameless. All have had their petty differences and traded insults. That is hardly news on the Internet. But had he really wanted to discover why others think and feel the way they do he would have had that conversation by now. He hasn’t because he doesn’t want it, he wants something else.

    Stay tuned….

  120. One question, Tony – did you take out any low-rate government sponsored loans to help finance your law degrees? Because if you did, you owe us. A lot. You wouldn’t have that cushy job otherwise, so stop griping.

  121. heh. good luck, car. he only wants to talk about his Prestigious Degrees — not about how he actually paid for ’em.

  122. Who the hell “paves roads”? Is this some usage I’m unfamiliar with, or is there some crazy difference between Australian and American roads that I’ve never heard of?

    It’s just a usage difference — we call surfacing a road with asphalt “paving.” There are no paving stones involved.

  123. I paid in excess of 74k in Federal taxes last year. You’d be surprised how “conservative” that would make you.

    Dude, that’s a whole lot of money your giving away to taxes. If you think that the Republicans are going to save your money, think again. If Rudy Giuliani wins, he’ll spend more money than Bush is spending right now (Bush spends at least 2 trillion a year which is even more than the so-called “liberal” Bill Clinton spent.) No sir, the “conservatives” will just waste your money on military.

    I wish the tax resistors Ed and Elaine Brown luck. They’ll need it.

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