We haven’t heard the candidates address how they expect an abortion ban to be reasonably enforced. It’s a legal question, not simply a moral one.
I find it distasteful that many of the Republicans seem to think it’s an issue to be dealt with by individual states. There are plenty of states who, left to their own devices, would certainly make it illegal to get or perform abortions. What happens then? The middle-class and up still get their safe, legal abortions in other states, but the poor women who don’t have that option are forced into either having an unwanted child or getting an illegal, and possibly dangerous procedure.
The Federal Abortion Ban proved once and for all that abortion will never be left to the states. As soon as Republicans are in power, they pass conservative federal laws. As soon as they are out of power, they say “Leave it to the States!” Just look at the difference between W the Governor and W the President/King.
Aw, come on. Everybody knows that there’s no difference between the Dems and Reps. Ralph Nader told us so. Although even the most retrograde, corporate-owned miserable excuses for Democrats in the field manage to recognize a right to privacy and bodily autonomy, and only Rudy (a closet fascist on almost every other privacy issue) can manage to acknowledge women as full human beings on the other side, there’s no difference.
There’s definitely a difference between the Dems and Reps. But that doesn’t mean that they can’t all suck. They just don’t suck equally. 🙂
I agree with Roxie. He’s the only one that recognizes that women are people. Even Hillary fell back on the “we should have the right, but omg it’s such a SAD thing *looks around nervously*”. It’s like we can’t admit that it’s not always the OMG WORST THING EVAH.
Yeah I liked Obama’s view too. He saw that we are people and understand the differences in lives lived.
There is not a word in the text of that document, nor in any of its amendments, that conceivably addresses abortion. One of the ‘publicanos said that. I can’t believe these people utter such stupid nonsense and keep a straight face. Women weren’t considered a part of the constitution then you fuck! Why can’t someone just say this kind of obvious shit to someone like, say, on the Tube? Over and over again? Only one of the dems didn’t feel compelled to preach about how abortion is a ‘horrible decision’. Gawd, no it isn’t, many women rejoice at not being saddled by an unwanted pregnancy, or maybe even being able to wake up alive after the nightmare of miscarriage/forced delivery is over. This wingnut fascism has spread like a disease and they’ve all got it, every damn one of them is sick with it.
No, what pisses me off is the one that wants to make some law protecting all the widdle embwyos at conception. Pack up your ovaries ladies, one day they’ll be arguing over whether or not women can take the Pill. MOTHER FUCKERS!!! AAAHAHHH!!!!!! Sorry, I don’t know where that came from…
Personally, though I like Obama I don’t give a shit if he trusts women to make their own decisions. No one asked him. What the hell does that even mean anyway? What other decisions do you trust me to make? Can I still pick my own groceries? What about my brand of tampons? Hey, is it possible that I could choose my own career? That’d be great! That is beyond condescending. Women have always made their own decisions about bearing children and will continue to do so. The only question is whether we can have a safe medical procedure or an illegal one. Neither has proven to stop abortion, we just no longer have abortion wards in every hospital or “mysterious” infertility” problems. Sorry for the rant but that one line upset me more than the all the crap (combined!) that the Repug candidates had to say.
Spot on, Pockysmama. Having an abortion has nothing to do with trust, other than trusting that the conditions are sanitary and that the person performing the surgery has medical training.
At the risk of getting tangental: what is the anti abortion rationale for dealing with ectopic pregnancies? If life starts at conception, then by that reasoning an embryo that implants in the fallopian tube is a life, and operating to remove it is taking that life. Do we have to wait for our oviduct to rupture of its own accord in order to avoid being a murderer? Peritonitis or hell: now there’s a choice. Has anyone asked the pro lifers to give a position on this?
I’m not sure about everyone anti-abortion, but I know that the Catholic hospitals fall back on “doctrine of double effect” there. That is, it’s morally acceptable to remove the piece of the Fallopian tube with the embryo because your intent is not to kill it, your intent is to save the mother’s life. But, and here’s where it gets truly weird, giving methotrexate instead is seen as more directly killing the embryo and is not allowed. Basically they will submit you to a more invasive and more dangerous procedure to satisfy their twisted moral reasoning. If I ever think there is even the slightest risk I might have an ectopic pregnancy, there is no way in hell I will go to a Catholic hospital. If you’re post menarche and pre-menopause and you have abdominal pain, it’s a good idea to do likewise. I found this source, which considers methotrexate possibly acceptable to some theologians — but that this is even a moral issue gives me chills: http://www.chausa.org/Pub/MainNav/News/HP/Archive/1998/07JulyAug/Articles/Features/hp9807e.htm
orlando: the Catholic church’s stand, at least, is to wait until the tube to burst and…then try and mop up the ladybits. No, doesn’t matter that the embryo is doomed, that the woman’s fertility may suffer, it’s a BABY dammit, and like hell if they’re going put a mere woman above an innocent child.
Whoa Lindsay. “Widdle embwyos?” Some of us dyed in the wool feminists still find the life within our bodies rather sacred. You may come to some different conclusions than I do on the whole subject, but you, too, are here on this planet because a woman, i.e. your mother, allowed that life or proto life to become you. I respect that and I don’t think that the abortion debate is either stupid or lacking in complexity. Do you wish it were?
yeah, i thought obama sounded paternalistic too. not to mention that he included all those other people in helping the woman make her decision. mike gravel is my favorite on this one. thanks for posting this, jill.
Wow Duncan Hunter is a crazy motherfucker. I emailed his campaign asking how he plans to enforce his Right to Life Act that bestows all the rights of a citizen onto spooge dripping out of a woman’s vagina.
My fundie mom-in-law says ectopic is ok to “abort” ’cause there’s no way the “life” will make it anyway. I also want to say thanks for the post. It’s great to have them all in one place and as a place to point people who are, shall we say, time-challenged?