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Dates with Daddy

chastity
Superior hymen protection, and ostentatious appearance to make sure everyone knows your intact status. The perfect gift for your own Purity Girl.

This Glamour article has been out for a while, but it’s worth reading, just in case previous posts about Purity Balls didn’t leave you sufficiently grossed out.

The man’s date? His 25-year-old daughter. Welcome to Colorado Springs’ Seventh Annual Father-Daughter Purity Ball, held at the five-star Broadmoor Hotel. The event’s purpose is, in part, to celebrate dad-daughter bonding, but the main agenda is for fathers to vow to protect the girls’ chastity until they marry and for the daughters to promise to stay pure. Pastor Randy Wilson, host of the event and cofounder of the ball, strides to the front of the room, takes the microphone and asks the men, “Are you ready to war for your daughters’ purity?”


The Christian Warrior schtick seems like a relatively new direction for the religious right. Instead of a touchy-feely, feed-the-poor, WWJD type of Christianity, they’ve developed an aggressive, hyper-masculine religion which blends seamlessly into the Republican war machine. This Christianity is blatantly misogynist, positioning women as items to be transferred from father to husband; it labels us tempting Jezebels when we don’t toe the line (and often even when we do), deserving of whatever ills befall us if we break out of their submissive female mold; it unapologetically considers women sub-human, and deserving of fewer human rights than all other people — fewer rights, even, than a fetus, upon which they confer super-human privileges that no born people are given. This Christianity is unconcerned with the bodies stacked up in its wake. This Christianity is not the Christianity that I know, where church-goers work in soup kitchens on the weekends, volunteer with local kids, recognize the value in all human beings, regardless of their faith or lack of it.

The Christianity that I know isn’t about going to war or coercing four-year-olds into signing purity pledges (no, I’m not being hyperbolic — read the Glamour article). It’s not about turning the female body into a commodity for men to pass from one to another. It doesn’t look like this:

The older girls at the Broadmoor tonight are themselves curvaceous and sexy in backless dresses and artful makeup; next to their fathers, some look disconcertingly like wives. In fact, in the parlance of the purity ball folks, one-on-one time with dad is a “date,” and the only sanctioned one a girl can have until she is “courted” by a man. The roles are clear: Dad is the only man in a girl’s life until her husband arrives, a lifestyle straight out of biblical times. “In patriarchy, a father owns a girl’s sexuality,” notes psychologist and feminist author Carol Gilligan, Ph.D. “And like any other property, he guards it, protects it, even loves it.”

When it’s time for dads and daughters to take the pledge (some informally exchange rings as well), the men stand over their seated daughters and read aloud from parchment imprinted with the covenant: “I, [father’s name], choose before God to cover my daughter as her authority and protection in the area of purity….” The men inscribe their names and their daughters sign as witnesses. Then everyone returns to their meals and an excited buzz fills the room.

He stands over his seated daughter while he pledges to be her hymenial authority. Quite the image.

Fathers are important characters in the lives of their daughters. But not because they’re good guards of their daughters’ vaginas, or because they can use their “authority” to coerce their children into signing contracts they don’t understand, or because they’re uniquely positioned to instill in their daughters devastatingly fucked up views of sex and men:

I strike up a conversation with Christy Parcha, an 18-year-old brunette who’s here to perform a ballet later on; her 10-year-old sister is attending the ball with their dad, Mike, a math teacher at a local community college. Christy’s eyes are bright, her cheeks flushed, and a smile permanently animates her face. Although she just graduated from high school, she is not going to college but instead will be teaching ballet classes, continuing with piano lessons and writing a book about “emotional purity,” which Christy thinks is even more important than the physical kind. “I am just trying to reserve all those special feelings for my husband,” she says ardently.

As it turns out, not allowing herself to think sexual thoughts makes her nervous, too, because she wants to experience pleasure with her future husband: “I don’t want to be a burden to him in that I am not enjoying [sex].” Recently, a friend took her to see a movie about Queen Esther, One Night With the King—“a really romantic story,” according to Christy. “So I watched it and I had these huge feelings rise up inside me, and I was like, ‘OK, they are still there!’” she says, flopping back in her chair with relief. Still, Christy doesn’t want to date. She associates sex outside of marriage as a girl “getting used, betrayed, having guys deceive you, all that kind of thing.”

Other girls at the ball are far less eloquent about the pledge they’ve just made. To them, the excitement of the ball is buying fancy dresses and primping; one 14-year-old in the bathroom tells me she started getting ready at 9 A.M. When I ask Hannah Smith, 15, what purity means to her, she answers, “I actually don’t know.” Her older sister Emily jumps in: “Purity, it means…I don’t know how to explain it. It is important to us that we promise to ourselves and to our fathers and to God that we promise to stay pure until…. It is hard to explain.” I suspect that the girls’ lack of vocabulary has to do with a universal truth of girlhood: You don’t want to talk about sex with anyone older than 18, particularly your dad. At the same time, the girls seem so unsure of the reasons behind their vows that I can’t help but wonder if they’ve just signed a contract whose terms they didn’t fully understand.

Oh, and the purity pledges don’t work. So in “protecting” their daughters, the hymen-fetishists are actually putting them in physical danger:

Disturbingly, the adolescent health study also found that STD rates were significantly higher in communities with a high proportion of pledgers. “Pledgers are less likely than nonpledgers to use condoms, so if they do have sex it is less safe,” says Peter Bearman, Ph.D., a Columbia University sociologist who helped design the study. For these teens, he believes, it’s a mind game: If you have condoms, you were planning to have sex. If you don’t, sex wasn’t premeditated, which makes it more OK. The study also found that even pledgers who remained virgins were highly likely to have oral and anal sex—risky behavior given that most probably didn’t use condoms to cut their risk.

Curiously, the teen pregnancy rate is on the decline nationwide. Proponents of an abstinence-only philosophy point to this as evidence that pledges work. But a just-released study by the Mailman School of Public Health at Columbia University attributed 14 percent of this drop to teens holding off on sex—and 86 percent to teens using more effective forms of birth control, like the Pill. Says study author John Santelli, M.D., a specialist in adolescent medicine, “If most of the progress in reducing teen pregnancy rates is due to improved contraceptive use, national policy needs to catch up with those realities.”

The author of this piece, Jennifer Baumgardner, is sympathetic to these girls and their families, but even she can’t avoid quotes which highlight how creepy some of these dads are:

When I point out to Christy Parcha’s father, Mike, that experience with relationships, bumps and all, can help young women mature emotionally and become ready for sex and marriage, he warily concedes that’s true. “But there can be damage, too,” he says. “I guess we’d rather err on the side of avoiding these things. The girl can learn after marriage.”
(…)
But, he continues, “I am not worried about that. She is not even going to come close to those situations. She believes, and I do too, that her husband will come through our family connections or through me before her heart even gets involved.”

“The girl,” I assume, is his daughter. Referred to as if she’s an object.


66 thoughts on Dates with Daddy

  1. A while back, I linked to an earlier post about these purity/integrity balls, to the tune of “ew”, and got a guy asking me why I am disrespectful of another’s choice to be celibate before marriage – they’re just pledging to be celibate, the pledges are essentially the same, what’s the problem?

    I’ll post a link to this post, too, but it’s always unnerving to me that there are actually real people out there who are entirely blind to the fact that people are objectifying women in this utterly blatant fashion.

    He stands over his seated daughter while he pledges to be her hymenial authority.

    In other news, I imagine a father standing on empty chairs on either side of his daughter, beating his chest and shouting at the other males in the pack. I may have had too much caffeine.

  2. The Christian Warrior schtick seems like a relatively new direction for the religious right.

    Nah, it’s not new. It’s been part of the Catholic conservative gig for as long as I’ve been around, over 30 years now when my parents’ friends and teachers and other aquaintances were involved in it, between working for Reagan to destroy the NEA etc, and campaigning for Buchanan and Keyes, they agonized that Mr. Rogers would make little boys gay with his emphasis on nonviolent solutions, and obsessed over female chastity and their own hardons/envy caused by women showing skin, or just the fact that they’re bifurcated mammals. Manly!Warrior!Christians sneering at all the weak womanly gentle-Jesus stuff and longing for the Crusades again, daydreaming themselves Charles “The Hammer” Martel smiting the heathen – are the same folks who helped bring you Bush II – Return of the Military-Industrial Complex. Check out the archives of First Things and Crisis – those two magazines a) get gobs of money from the Four Sisters and their ilk, b) are respectively run by Fr. Neuhaus, seen at the gazillion-dollar-a-plate dinner where Bush II made his “base” joke, and Deal Hudson, former Catholic Liason to the White House – both of them former Protestants (Lutheran and Baptist, iirc) who decided that their denominations were way too liberal and peaceful-girly.

  3. Here’s a new twist for me–the fathers sign the pledge as active participants and the girls just sign the pledge as witnesses. They aren’t even given enough agency to choose “purity”. They are only allowed to witness their fathers’ choices.

    This is just some sick shit.

  4. I think the girl is any individual girl in this situation, not necessarily his daughter. He was just talking about young women in general a moment before.

  5. Caren—on the other hand, it makes for a nice reality check for the fathers and the pageant organizers when she has sex and points out to them that nobody ever got any promises from her, and they have no authority in the matter—it’s like me making a promise to the local car dealership that President Bush will pay for my new Mustang. No one ever made a bargain with her, and that means their sexism here causes a significant liability in terms of the strength of the contract; it reduces it from a disturbing contract to an utter farce which they are too dense to notice.

    You are right, of course—but it amuses me immensely the tactical mistake it causes.

  6. Some of Deal Hudson’s thoughts [sic].

    And yes, he not only was the WH liason, but he was also the guy who had to retire from his prominent post when it came out that he’d lost his teaching job for getting (at least one) underage student drunk and molesting her…which, of course, was just a mistake, a past sin that shouldn’t be held against him now, no matter that he’d lied about it indignantly subsequently until proof forthcame.

  7. There’s just soo many nasty undercurrents which have already been pointed out in previous posts. Ick.

  8. Yeah, I was going to say what Andrew said first. He’s just going for a generic “the girl” there, I think.

  9. This totally reminds me of that episode of Arrested Development with the Mother Boy event. Except this isn’t hilarious so much as sad.

  10. This Christianity is blatantly misogynist, positioning women as items to be transferred from father to husband; it labels us tempting Jezebels when we don’t toe the line (and often even when we do), deserving of whatever ills befall us if we break out of their submissive female mold; it unapologetically considers women sub-human, and deserving of fewer human rights than all other people — fewer rights, even, than a fetus, upon which they confer super-human privileges that no born people are given. This Christianity is unconcerned with the bodies stacked up in its wake. This Christianity is not the Christianity that I know, where church-goers work in soup kitchens on the weekends, volunteer with local kids, recognize the value in all human beings, regardless of their faith or lack of it.

    The Christianity that I know isn’t about going to war or coercing four-year-olds into signing purity pledges (no, I’m not being hyperbolic — read the Glamour article). It’s not about turning the female body into a commodity for men to pass from one to another. It doesn’t look like this:

    Sadly, this is the only one I see anymore. And I’ve grown to actually hate religion. I can’t even be passive or tolerant when all it creates is shit like this.

  11. I’ve heard all the other crap, and am running out of outrage for it, but the note on emotional purity was a new twist.

    “I am just trying to reserve all those special feelings for my husband,” she says ardently.

    That famine mentality keeps coming up. Like she only has so much love allotted for her entire lfie, so she has to save it.

    Its the same thing with the virginity obsession. Saving herself for him. There’s that meme that the first time is so utterly special that’s spread around young women, that makes people convinved that they’ve done something wrong if they sleep with a guy and it doesn’t work out.

    And actually getting with a guy, someone who isn’t enough to make them happy but “its so hard to find a good man” so they stick with him.

    From person life, it creeps into politics. There’s only so many jobs or so much prosperity to go around so immigrants are “stealing” their jobs and money.

    Denying LGBT civil rights, because any room in our society for other people is seen as less room for them.

    Only one God, only room for one way of seeing that god, and no room for science to coexist with the interpretation with the Bible.

    I think these people could starve in a grocery store.

  12. Whoa – I haven’t picked up a grocery store women’s magazine in probably a year, but I picked exactly this issue up today and read this story.

  13. Ick indeed.

    I think Ragnell has it right – perhaps the Protestants are trying to make up for missing out on all the Catholic self-flagellation? Denying others rather than denying yourself.

  14. I’ve got a daughter. She’s four right now. The thought of having anything to do with anything like this makes me–literally–nauseous. Really, I wonder how many of these virginal girls are victims of molestation by the men guarding their hymens. This is sick beyond sick. And if that’s intolerance, I don’t want to be tolerant.

  15. Because that’s the best time ever to figure out that you can’t deal with the realities of a close relationship with someone you are NOT related to by birth, right? After you’ve legally bound yourself to him, and your religion tells you it’s a ginormous sin to dissolve that union. *headdesk!*

    I actually had both of my husband’s grandmothers say to us that they wished that they had been able to live with their husbands before marriage when they were young. ‘Cause I guess that whole “saving it all for marriage” ain’t all it’s cracked up to be, and they were wise enough to recognize it and admit it in their old age. All I’m seeing here is an entire generation of girls that are going to get REALLY disillusioned about sex and love and marriage, and the aftermath (and damage to their kids) is going to be tragic. And NO, I really don’t have an issue with staying celibate before marriage. It’s the whole narrow, no free will for the womenfolk mindset that I have an issue with.

  16. OK, I managed to frak up the block quote. I was *trying* to quote the guy above saying “The girl can learn that after marriage.”

    *sigh* Technology and I have a rather uneasy working relationship….

  17. Whether the “girl” referred to at the end of the post is his daughter or a generic “girl,” Jill’s poin stands: women are treated as objects to be passed from one man to the next, first as vessels for a hymen, then as vessels for a fetus. I also love the fact that a woman is still a “girl,” even after being married: Hot XXXian child bride action!!!

  18. “Like she only has so much love allotted for her entire lfie, so she has to save it.”

    In a way, this is true. If their idea of a woman’s love is cooking, scrubbing, vacuuming, washing, hop-and-fetching, and breeding with a permanent smile on her face until she’s replaced, then, yeah, conceivably, there’s only so much of that in a given woman. Give her an asshole of a man who doesn’t even have the common decency not to stand back and piss all over the toilet at every opportunity – even if she’s only has him just for a little while – and she’s got even less, I bet.

    So, in a fundie household, I can see how a slave wife that has been sold down the river, so to speak, might not “love” like one who’s never left the plantation hearth before.

  19. It’s no error that stallions cover mares, and these fathers pledge to cover their daughters, is it?

    Just like the last 23 times this story was posted, Scorpio.

  20. I would love to see “mind balls”, wherein fathers would pledge to encourage and uphold the education of their daughters, training them well to become critical thinkers who explore the boundaries of knowledge in any and all fields they choose, knowing that the self-confidence to make one’s own decisions and the education to make those decisions wisely is the most important gift they can give their daughters.

    Think they would?

  21. Good to know that the good ol Christian soldiers are still looking after our bodies/vaginas for us, huh? I would love to say that this kind of thing does not happen in the UK but no doubt tomorrow there will be a post on the BBC website claiming that a Highland Presbytarian Church has decided to shackle women’s vagina’s closed in an effort to stop them from sullying the reputation of the clan. Deary me, the world has indeed, gone bonkers.

  22. There’s so much to be angry about I actually have a hard time focusing on just one thing.

    Well besides the fact that every single one of these males sound like either those creepy guys who collect thousands of dolls and make shrines for them or pedophile child molestors, I think I’d like to mention how bad this is for people who are asexual like me or abstinent by choice (like many of my friends).

    All of the abstinents I know (and many are so because of religion or beliefs that the first time is special) do so not because they are ignorant of sex or even revulsed by it, but because of genuine conviction that it is something that can wait and that they themselves would be happier if they did so. None of them has ever told someone else that they should refrain from sex or that engaging in sex makes them less than a person and all of them are if not feminist, at least chivalric.

    These people are an insult to them and do them great harm by associating what should be a choice made out of personal decision and conviction into a really creepy way to turn your daughters into slaves and reinforce all the hideous gender roles of chattel and owner that we abolished (or at least tried to) from this country.

    Overall, it’s bad for those involved, it’s bad for women and people everywhere as they try to force these chattel no-education programs, and it eliminates the ability for one to be chaste for themselves and their own reasons as well as diminishing what they believe and perverting it for their own purposes.

    It just goes to prove that the people really running this don’t even care about the fact that “oh no, teh sluts are having teh sex. MORALS!!!” but rather just hate the fact that women may be going around and deciding for themselves what they want instead of differing to their ill-gotten false authority. The sooner we raze this trend, the better. They don’t care about the babies, the sex, or the morals. They just don’t like not owning women and what that means to their access of sex and power.

  23. Can you imagine being a young teenager and having all your friends going to the Purity Ball; a mini-prom where you get to buy a pretty new dress, new shoes, wear makeup and have your hair done? Plus a nice dinner, music, and special time with Dad. Wouldn’t you want to go to be with your friends and get an opportunity to dress up? Wouldn’t you feel horribly left out if you didn’t go?

    The funny thing is that the purity contract is then expected. You don’t go to the ball with the intent of NOT signing it. And you don’t get to go if you won’t sign, right?

    Is the Purity Ball really necessary? Or just a manipulation tool?

    This sort of thing preys upon the “princess” fantasies of young girls. All it does is create a want without any satisfaction for it.

  24. Ick.

    You know, there can be something extremely erotic about waiting for sex – whether you’re a virgin or not. But you do it because you’ve made a conscious decision – NOT because you’ve entered an Oedipal pact with Daddy (yes, I believe that the story of Oedipus can be gender-netural). There’s a reason why the Greeks warned us about this shit.

  25. I would love to see “mind balls”, wherein fathers would pledge to encourage and uphold the education of their daughters, training them well to become critical thinkers who explore the boundaries of knowledge in any and all fields they choose, knowing that the self-confidence to make one’s own decisions and the education to make those decisions wisely is the most important gift they can give their daughters.

    Think they would?

    Well, not to be trite, but this is exactly what my dad did, and we didn’t have to get dressed up to do it. He also taught me and my sister to play softball and shoot baskets. AND he was hardly ever around! I guess it goes to show that being a good parent means more than just being physically present.

  26. Electra is a bit weird – all she really wanted to do was have her brother kill her mother, unless I’m mistaken. I mean, sure, Freud said that she meant a whole lot more by that… But I like Oedipus more. His story is more layered.

  27. I have never appreciated my dad more than when I read these articles. Or maybe I just appreciate that I was an adolescent before these things became popular…he was fundie and might have been sucked in. shudder.Dodged that bullet.

  28. I guess it’s spelled with either a C or a K. I actually thought as I was looking it up “am I gonna get corrected about some stupid Jennifer Garner movie on this one?” Oh well.

  29. Hahahahahahaha!!!! Jennifer Garner! I forgot all about that movie! It looked so bad that I nearly choked on the popcorn, laughing in the theater when the preview came out!

    Elektra is the comic book character – Electra is the original.

    I think.

  30. I would love to see “mind balls”

    That’s kind of what my dad did with me. There were some occasions when he had an event to attend and he took me instead of my mom – not as a creepy thing, not as an opportunity to show off the object that he owned, but to expose me to the real world and teach me how to behave in public, carry on a polite conversation, and so forth. It was wonderful, because not only was it an opportunity for the extremely girlie girl that I was back then to get dressed up all pretty, it was fantastic for my self-esteem. I got to talk to fairly important people, express my opinion on issues, participate in “grownup” conversations – I got to practice being an adult, which I think is so much more valuable than practicing being a sheltered object. Plus, I got some really good bonding time with my dad, who spent a whole lot of time working during that period of my life.

    He, of course, taught me to use power tools and to fix my car and all of that as well, but discussing education politics with a gubernatorial candidate was a fairly singular experience.

  31. Freud would have had a field day with this one. Or a conniption. Not sure which. However, the driving force behind the purity balls is not the girls’ desires, but those of their fathers. So this is more of a reverse Elektra complex, aka child molestation, than any kind of Elektra/Oedipal complex.

  32. Dianne, I absolutely agree with you there. If she’s not even an active participant, but just a witness to her daddy’s covering, then I doubt even Freud would say that she somehow wanted it.

    On second thought, I’m probably being too generous to Siggy.

  33. Slightly off topic, but the hard ‘c’ sound in (especially ancient) Greek is often represented with a ‘k’ in English, i.e., Herakles. As opposed to the Romanized/Latinized Heracles/Hercules, which is what we are more used to seeing in English.

    Having not read “Electra”, I can’t comment on content, but I like the comparison of the Purity Ball phenomenon to “Oedipus”! 🙂 I have to agree there’s a whole other dimension to his story that pertains to the shite being pedaled here.

    And it’s not as if the ancient Greeks weren’t misogynistic enough on their own. *sigh*

  34. He, of course, taught me to use power tools and to fix my car and all of that as well, but discussing education politics with a gubernatorial candidate was a fairly singular experience.

    You father let you dirty your hands with MAN’S WORK?!?!?!

    How are we EVER going to find you a husband?!?!?!

  35. The man’s date? His 25-year-old daughter.

    25? Isn’t she sort of old enough to make her own decisions about her body?

    As it turns out, not allowing herself to think sexual thoughts makes her nervous, too, because she wants to experience pleasure with her future husband: “I don’t want to be a burden to him in that I am not enjoying [sex].”

    Not “I want to enjoy sex within marriage,” but, “I don’t want to inhibit my husband’s pleasure.” A beautiful beginning to another unconsummated marriage.

  36. Frumious — you make it sound like a woman is ever allowed to make decisions about her body, as if she reaches a certain age and she’s no longer property. That’s adorbale!

  37. Wow, thanks for pointing that little detail out, Frumious. I missed it in the general insanity.

    Who the hell thinks like that?! I mean, sure, you want your husband to get off – but if he doesn’t want you to get off in turn – he’s got problems. In fact, I think men who are unconcerned with their partners’ satisfaction tend to be severely insecure underneath the bravado – the partners’ body mystifies them, they have NO IDEA how to approach it, how to make another person happy.

    The usage of the word “burden” is particularly creepy – when I can’t get off, I can’t get off. Sure, I might feel a bit guilty, but more so due to the fact that sex is supposed to be mutually pleasurable. At least in my book. And the pleasure is multi-layered: it’s physical, psychological, even spiritual. For a girl who is supposedly on the fast-track to salvation – for her to talk like that – it gives me the heebie jeebies. What kind of “sacred covenant” is she entering?

  38. Natalia — I’m thinking about a clip of Friends of God posted on Crooks and Liars a few days ago. In it, Ted Haggard (!!) was quizzing a handful of his male parishoners about their sex lives. “How often do you have sex with you wife?”
    “Every night” they answer.
    “How often does she climax?”
    “Every time,” they answer quickly.

  39. ::shiver::

    Every time I read about this, it skeeves me a little more.

    I like hanging out with my dad. He’s fun, and interesting, and brilliant.

    But he stays far the hell away from my sex life. And that’s as it should be.

    I’ve always had a positive, encouraging father figure.

    I also never had even the slightest notion I’d be a virgin on my wedding day.

  40. ::shiver::

    Every time I read about this, it skeeves me a little more.

    I like hanging out with my dad. He’s fun, and interesting, and brilliant.

    But he stays far the hell away from my sex life. And that’s as it should be.

    I’ve always had a positive, encouraging father figure.

    I also never had even the slightest notion I’d be a virgin on my wedding day.

  41. Freud would have had a field day with this one. Or a conniption.

    Freud would deny anything was happening. It’s what he did in Vienna–women who came in telling him they were molested were obviously simply expressing their fantasy of sleeping with their fathers.

    Freud was brilliantly wrong most of the time. Never more so than on that one.

  42. Jeff: You’re right, of course. In Freud’s (partial) defense, he did try to publish a report describing incidents of incest and how it affected the victims. He got clobbered. Basically, the medical establishment (and everyone else) told him that the patients he described, children of “respectible” middle class men, couldn’t possibly be the victims of incest. He caved under the pressure. But he was still left with these reports of incest. So he rationalized them to himself as fantasy, hence the Oedipal/Elektra complexes. It’s actually a wonderful case of how society forces researchers to skew their results to fit the society’s preformed prejudices.

  43. You know, it’s cute when a little girl–like, eight years old–gets all dressed up and goes to “Disney on Ice” and the Olive Garden with Daddy. Twenty-five? That’s sick.

    Shakes has a link to Betsy Hart (a conservative commentator)’s views on the phenomenon; she’s pro-celibacy before marriage, but she’s creeped out as well.

  44. The “purity ring” my dad gave me at just such a party when I was 13 is too small to come off my 21 year old finger. I forget it’s there most of the time, except when my dad uses it to remind me of his supposed “authority” as my father. The other day he told me that I am under his headship until the I marry and become the responsibility of my husband. He hasn’t been able to stop me from educating myself, maturing, and having safe sex with the men and women of my choosing, but he still thinks he has absolute patriarchal authority over my vagina. I have too many former friends who are already married to young men who are going to become the next generation of patriarchal, misguided, misogynist fathers and husbands intent on guarding the purity of something that never belonged to them. These people need to be stopped. They are scarier and more comitted than you can ever imagine and they are raising up armies of young fundamentalists. For every one of us that manages to reject their brainwashing, there are a hundred more who accept it.

  45. She believes, and I do too, that her husband will come through our family connections or through me before her heart even gets involved.”

    So, basically, you’re wanting arranged marriages. Great.

  46. The entire concept is sick and twisted. I’m really, really glad that my father was entirely squicked out by anything to do with my sisters and my sexuality and so never bothered all that much with this sort of thing. (The one exception was when I had a pregnancy scare in high school and he freaked (and wanted to press statutory rape charges on my just turned 18 boyfriend). Until my mom pointed out that they were just slightly older than I was at the time when I came along and wasn’t he a giant hypocrite for having a hissy fit over my behavior.) In fact, even now that all three of us have had children, he’d much prefer to pretend that we’re all still virgins and his grandchildren are just little miracles.

    And how in hell am I to raise my boys to be respectful, feminist, non-asshole men when they are exposed to this sort of crap on an almost daily basis from the rest of society. Are these idiots trying to make my job harder? Stupid question, I know, because of course they are.

  47. These weirdo dads are only half a step away from parading bloody sheets around town the morning after their daughter’s wedding to show the town what fantastic hymen guarding daddies they are.

    These people give me the ickies.

    I wonder if any of these women are aware that being treated like property isn’t flattering.

  48. The “purity ring” my dad gave me at just such a party when I was 13 is too small to come off my 21 year old finger.

    Come on over, I’ll cut it off (the ring) with my heavy duty wire cutter.

  49. The Christian Warrior schtick seems like a relatively new direction for the religious right

    This brought the evangelist, masculist group The Promise Keepers to mind. It wouldn’t surprise me in the least if any of these fathers are members of this group. In fact, it would surprise me if they weren’t.

  50. You father let you dirty your hands with MAN’S WORK?!?!?!

    How are we EVER going to find you a husband?!?!?!

    Yeah, I know, it’s shameful. You should see my hands; they’re like Scarlett O’Hara’s after she “went riding without her gloves.”

  51. When I was all caught up in Conservative Christianity in college, I wanted a purity ring because that was the cool thing to have. So my mom rolled her eyes all the way to the local Christian bookstore and got me one, (my Dad would have been totally skeeved out by even thinking about my sexuality). Luckily for me, my liberal Swedish mom told me that I should think of it as an an “integrity ring”, and the only promise I make by wearing it is to always be true to myself in relationships.

    In retrospect, that was a damn good promise to make to myself, with my mom’s support. That little “pact” between us always popped into my head when I felt pressure in dating relationships or were in compromising emotional situations, and when I finally did have sex (at 27…just a few weeks ago, whoo hoo!), it was because *I* was ready and with someone I care deeply for, not because I had permission by someone else’s moral code, not because the man pressured, not because my friends pressured. And if my relationship with him goes sour, I have no problem moving on if that is what is best for me. Not that everyone needs to going around making pledges, but I think that if a young girl is going to make a promise, being true to yourself and owning your decisions is a good one…and getting girls to think in terms of self-empowerment would probably actually delay sex longer than “purity” pledges.

  52. Oh…and to whoever metioned it, yes, these people are very close to wanting arranged marraiges. It is very popular in conservative Christian circles to advocate “emotional” purity, and choosing a future spouse purely on objective criteria, with the feelings and attraction to come later after the wedding day. This is actually a MUCH more popular notion than you may think…it was almost universal among a huge mainstream Christian group at Big Ten Univeristy that I went to freshman year of college, and at the Catholic school I graduated from it was absolute orthodoxy. This is not a small movement.

    These people are terrified of freedom and real intimacy.

    Their poor children of these marraiges are the ones I really feel for.

  53. 25? Isn’t she sort of old enough to make her own decisions about her body?

    Silly, silly Fruminous B. SHE is never old enough. Her potential husband is old enough from the moment HE decides HE wants to marry her.

    Re: C/K in Elektra. In Ancient Greek, there was no “C” per se; what we read as the hard C sound was always represented by a kappa (K). Sometimes it’s transliterated with a C, sometimes with a K, but neither is more correct because they’re both using letters that didn’t exist at the time.

  54. i don’t know about anyone else, but these chastity pledges and purity balls really creep me out completely. They seem so consumed with possessing and controlling the sexuality of the daughters that everytime I read their posts I think of the typical incest dynamic. It makes my skin crawl.

  55. So creepy. I am all for encouraging fathers to have a good relationship with their daughters, but this goes from relationship to posession. I went to a private all-girls high school, and we had an annual father-daughter dinner dance. I only went twice, since neither my dad nor I are big fancy dinner people, but I did like the concept. This purity ball thing just takes it to a whole new disturbing level.

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