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Because a Mother Who Has One Drink Must Be an Alcoholic

Good Lord. Ann at Feministing has a post about a Today show segment on mothers who get together for cocktails while their kids have playdates:

Many of my girlfriends have joked that when they have kids, they’re going to instruct their little tykes, “Now fetch mommy a cocktail!”

Well, the Today Show wasn’t kidding around when they put together this “trend” piece more or less alleging that mothers who have a glass of wine while their kids are playing nearby are bad caretakers. The story implies they don’t just drink, they get drunk: “There are safety issues to consider. Who would drive to the hospital if a child were hurt?” (Um, don’t know about this reporter, but I can have a glass of wine and still be under the legal blood-alcohol limit, perfectly fine to drive or watch children.)

Who would drive? If the kid really has to go to the hospital and the adults are actually impaired, how about a paramedic?

Smell the judgmentalism. From the MSNBC link:

Then, there’s the fine line between social and problem drinking. Psychologists suggest moms sometimes drink as a coping mechanism. Others say if you wouldn’t allow a caretaker to drink while watching your children, why the double standard? I’ll leave those debates to other moms (some who’ve blogged extensively on this) and the experts.

Indeed. Why the double standard? And I’m not talking about the caretaker/mother double standard. I’m talking about the double standard involving the utter absence of any sort of mention of men here. Why is it okay to see Daddy with a beer in front of the TV, but not okay to see Mommy with a glass of wine in the backyard?

In fact, Ann found a blog entry from Melissa Summers, which describes her contact with the producers and gives a window into NBC’s mentality on this one:

In the beginning they wanted to come and film my playgroup for the piece. Since our kids are now all in school full time, we don’t have a weekly playgroup anymore so this was problematic. I suggested a more ‘happy hour’ gathering where we’d meet after school and our husband’s would swing by after work for our usual family pizza night. Alicia [the NBC producer] said the mixing of dads would ‘taint’ the story (Read: “Make the subject more palatable because men keep their women in line and they have an auxiliary liver in their penises.”) So I told Alicia it just wasn’t going to work out.

She did wind up in the studio, somehow forced to defend alcoholic moms; she also discovered that somehow a gathering at which the women who did drink had one glass of wine apiece (and one didn’t drink at all) was presented as a “wine orgy.” Clearly, the idea that NBC wanted to present was that moms who drink at all are hopeless, falling-down drunks:

Alicia said it would be a live segment in the studio and there would be a psychologist, Dr Janet Taylor, there with me. Here is where the lies begin and this is a huge part of why I am so angry about the experience and am using this platform I have to explain it.

The psychologist is ‘on board’ with the whole thing. She’s a mother herself and understands. She’s just there to set limits and to explain what may be ‘a problem’. Which makes a lot of sense to me. Once we define problem drinking and how to know when you might be crossing over into that realm, we can have a light hearted conversation about moms getting together to be social while their children play. Just like Regular Grown Ups.

As time went on ramping up to my appearance. The psychologist bit seemed to be changing a little. Alicia informed me the psychologist was now feeling like she had to say mother’s of very young babies shouldn’t be drinking (something I still disagreed with, but okay….), “…you know things like that.”

Right before Alicia left town (she was not on set for my appearance….hmm….surprising) she said, (something like, I’m starting to realize why she always wanted to talk on the phone, not via email) “Now, Dr Janet Taylor’s position has changed a bit. She’s feeling like as a professional she has a responsibility to make sure women understand the risks.”

Which still, I was okay with because in my world there is a difference between drinking and drinking to get drunk.

In the end I showed up on a show with Dr Janet Taylor, well trained media machine who was not discussing drinking in moderation but was instead talking about women as children who have no clue how to drink in moderation and can not be trusted.

I was told this was going to be a ‘lighthearted’ discussion. I pictured talking about how no one is talking about ‘Kids And Keggers!’, I pictured discussing drinking as a social activity many adults do, I pictured discussing how my husband and I often drink as a social activity at kid centered activities and not a single reporter or television has ever called to ask my husband “what that glass of beer means to him”. I wanted to emphasize how silly it is to call this a trend. I wanted to emphasize how mothers are raising children, they are not children themselves.

I was not at all prepared for a debate between “Melissa Summers, blogger!” and “Dr Janet Taylor, psychologist with impressive resume and four kids.” I was especially not prepared for a debate which involved Dr Janet Taylor repeating the same thing over and over like a very tall robot.

Let me say a little something about that. My father was a hopeless, falling-down drunk, so I am intimately familiar with the damage that does to kids. The man drank a liter of Dewar’s every single night and passed out by 9 p.m. on weeknights. Weekends, he got an earlier start, so he would often be drunk during the day. I was in the car with him more than once as he held a glass of scotch between his legs. He and his alcoholism ruled the house and the family. To this day, I can’t watch TV with the volume up, because that was one of the things that would wake him up and bring him downstairs in a violent rage. Same thing with shouting. Can’t stand it. And that’s only the tip of the iceberg of the psychological damage his alcoholism did to me and to the entire family.

My mother rarely drank at all. Mostly, I think, because she felt that someone had to look out for the kids while her husband was drunk (that, and if she had a drink while we were out, someone would bug her for the cherry in her drink, which annoyed her). On the rare few occasions when she’d have a drink or two — and it was only ever a drink or two — Jesus, the kids loved it. Mom got giggly and loosened up a little. Come to think about it, that was usually when my father was away on business.

Believe me, there’s no comparison between how my father drank and how my mother did, and we knew the difference. There’s no comparision between a serious drunk and women who get together for a glass or two of wine while their kids play. It serves no one to lose the distinction between drinking and alcoholism. And I’m not even talking about denial — trust me, my father was King of Denial, so I know it when I see it. I’m talking about judging women more harshly for doing the same things that men do, and judging mothers most harshly of all.


43 thoughts on Because a Mother Who Has One Drink Must Be an Alcoholic

  1. Believe me, there’s no comparison between how my father drank and how my mother did, and we knew the difference. There’s no comparision between a serious drunk and women who get together for a glass or two of wine while their kids play.

    What’s also ridiculous is that no one discusses what the benefits of kids seeing their parents drink responsibly are.

  2. Absolutely. My models were pretty much extremes, which is not very good for developing a healthy relationship with alcohol.

  3. My father was an alcoholic too, and that description hit horribly home to me. I hardly drink at all now either except on special occasions.

    (Speaking of which, if you want to see parents dead drunk, try a British kids party – the festivities go on into the night while the children fall asleep exhausted under the table and the Mums and Dads get the wine out. No doubt NBC would have all those children taken into care and the mothers arrested, tarred and feathered, because of course it’s always those damned silly women who’re irresponsible. The dads? Oh they’re just having a manly Good Time.)

    I have to wonder – how many of those ultra-respectable TV presenters have a little snort of coke before going home to the kids in the evening?

  4. Why is it okay to see Daddy with a beer in front of the TV, but not okay to see Mommy with a glass of wine in the backyard?

    Because it’s the mommy’s job to take care of the kiddies, not the daddy’s. This is an expectation still prevalent in our culture. Even your formulation hints at it: Daddy is nursing his beer in front of the TV, while Mommy is in the backyard with the kids, keeping them busy so that they will leave Daddy alone. The supposition is that Daddy, because he is at home, is entitled to unwind, while Mommy, because she is at home, is at work. The home, for the husband and father, is a locus of relaxation, because he is supposed to work outside the home, whereas for the wife and mother, the home is a locus of labor, because she is supposed to work inside the home, whether or not she has a job outside the home as well. (BTW, I’m not talking here about what I believe, but about what people in general seem to think.)

    If Mommy were to take a glass of wine with her into the backyard, that would be just as if Daddy were to keep a flask of bourbon in his desk at work: it would be behavior of the type we all call “inappropriate” because it indicates a willingness to elide the boundaries which are set up between work and relaxation. We all know that stuff like this happens (that men drink on the job, that women drink in front of the kids who are their job) but we all join together in agreeing that it is “unfortunate”, not so much because we think that drunken men will fall down the fire stairs at work or because we think that tipsy mothers will be unable to drive their tykes to Emergency should their tykes fall off the teeter-totter, as because we want to show that we (as opposed to the benighted souls who engage in “unfortunate” or “inappropriate” behavior) know where the lines are drawn. We want to demonstrate, first, our familiarity with our own cultural shibboleths, and second, that we are not only willing and able but qualified to conform to said shibboleths. (Pretty much all morning TV programming, so far as I can tell, seems to be dedicated to just such a demonstration.)

    [Disclaimer: 1) Adults getting dangerously drunk = Bad Thing; 2) Adults getting dangerously drunk in front of children = Very Bad Thing. Nothing in the comment posted above is to be taken as proof that I make excuses for Very Bad Things, even though Very Bad Things do happen in this life, and even though they are, IMO, no less likely to occur if they are routinely confused with things that are Not So Bad After All. I’m just sayin’.]

  5. oh sweet mercy – This is insane. just when did it become manditory that women, once they have children have to give up every single adult activity in order to raise their offspring? I must have missed that memo.
    Did it occour to the lunatics at Today that you know rasing a kid can at times be a pretty rotten job and getting together with other women with kids and having a glass of wine and being able to talk like an adult once a f-king week might make things a bit easier? All I can say is either none of these clowns have kids or they have palmed the off on full time nannies.

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  7. There’s no comparision between a serious drunk and women who get together for a glass or two of wine while their kids play. It serves no one to lose the distinction between drinking and alcoholism.

    Yes, but this really has nothing to do with concern for children and everything to do with making sure women never experience any pleasure, or, if we somehow fail in that, making sure that they always feel more guilt than pleasure. If they eat, they’re fatty fat-fats, if they have sex, they’re wanton sluts. Up till now, no one had noticed the disturbing trend of mothers having a glass of wine. Swarm! Swarm!! After all, these moms are going to be too drunk to drive their kids to the emergency room after the kid gets mauled by the mountain lion she was playing with, which never would have happened in the first place if mom hadn’t been shitfaced. It’s bad enough they had sex (which they must have if they have kids — oh, the horror!), now they’re going to have a glass of wine? This must be stopped.

  8. Why is it okay to see Daddy with a beer in front of the TV, but not okay to see Mommy with a glass of wine in the backyard?

    Because everything is Mommy’s fault. That’ll be $150.

  9. I’ve been following this whole blow up over at Melissa’s blog (and I watched the segment the other day online) and it is completely ridiculous. Moms are adults and we don’t give up every claim to being so just because we have children. And our brains don’t slide out the vagina with the baby, either. My parents drank in front of us (hell, my dad did a lot more than that sometimes), I drink in front of my kids, and I don’t see the issue in it. Sometimes Mom or Dad will have a glass of something with dinner or while watching tv in the evening. I think modeling a healthy relationship with alcohol is a good thing for the kids.

    In fact, I’ve taken my kids to grad student parties where several people were falling down drunk. Usually the parties are only people we know well and hang out with sober also, and there are a few people who bring their kids (because we all live far from family and, modern life being what it is, babysitters we know and trust are few and hard to come by). The kids get to watch a video, one or two of the parents stays relatively sober, and we all have a great time. I truly don’t see why it is a problem to see adult women socializing as adults, even when there are children present. There is a real difference between my life (and my parents’ lives, etc.) and what zuzu described as raging alcoholism.

  10. My models were pretty much extremes, which is not very good for developing a healthy relationship with alcohol.

    Y’know what? My mom was a drunk. My sister and I, we never saw her get drunk. We saw her drink. We saw her drunk. If she was drinking with us around, it was generally in more moderation than she seemed to exhibit between work and coming home. It created quite a disconnect for us, to see those two extremes within one person, and not be able to as easily link the kind of behavior you described from your father (and thank you for your openness, btw) to its cause.
    I dunno what that has to do with the NBC piece, except that it’s demonizing exactly the wrong behavior. And what everyone else said.

  11. Sigh. As a recovering alcoholic whose drink-fueled destructive behavior did tremendous damage, it’s hard to put into words how stupid this is. I grew up with a mother who never drank, terrified of the memories of her own late alcoholic father, whose pattern I ended up imitating. I might have benefitted from seeing some healthy moderation.

    I don’t drink, of course, but my wife likes a glass or two of good wine, and I can’t imagine that will change when she becomes a mother.

  12. If Mommy were to take a glass of wine with her into the backyard, that would be just as if Daddy were to keep a flask of bourbon in his desk at work: it would be behavior of the type we all call “inappropriate” because it indicates a willingness to elide the boundaries which are set up between work and relaxation.

    Yes, and this is something I probably should have expanded on in the post. Note that the reporter sets up the “double standard” as between a paid caretaker and the mother. Implication: the two are equivalent, and when the mother is on duty, she’s as much on the job as a paid babysitter. So drinking in front of the kids, for a mother, is equivalent to drinking on the job.

  13. This kind of propaganda can be really damaging to kids, too. I grew up thinking that my parents might have a drinking problem because they usually had a glass of wine with dinner, and my anti-drug program at school suggested that there was something wrong with that.

  14. Y’know, I think it’s weird that society pushes to medicate half of the kids because they’re “hyperactive” (i.e., behaving like children), but they spazz out when Mom has a sip of wine.

    I grew up with a mother who never drank, terrified of the memories of her own late alcoholic father, whose pattern I ended up imitating. I might have benefitted from seeing some healthy moderation.

    My mom was the same way: in 23 years, I think I’ve seen her take a sip (of champagne) exactly twice. In fact, her mother and sisters all think of drinking as this terrible terrible thing and I’ve only ever seen them very disdainfully refuse to drink when offered.

  15. Man. The idea that it’s acceptable to shake your finger at a mother who, you know, does things she enjoys occasionally instead of spending every waking moment focusing solely on her children’s needs– well, it’s not that I’m *surprised*, more that it still pisses me off. Parents who model responsible attitudes towards alcohol for their kids are doing a *good job,* for heaven’s sake.

    My parents never saw a thing wrong with having a drink at dinner– *a* drink, not getting roaring drunk– and even offered my sisters and I a sip from time to time. Of course, to our kiddie tastebuds, it was so gross we never thought of alcohol as cool or glamorous or desirable. For that matter, my dad used to call the house when he was golfing and have my sister and I grab a couple of beers out of the fridge and ride our bikes over to meet him– then he’d take us for lunch. I’m so very traumatized, I’m sure.

  16. As everyone here agrees on, there is a clear distinct difference between having a healthy relationship to alcohol, which includes being ok with taking a glass of wine once in a while, and an unhealthy relationship to alcohol – which can either be thinking all alcohol is abuse or that it’s ok to bringe-drink.

    I grew up with an alcoholic father who didn’t drink anything in general (he had a pattern of falling of the wagon a few times every year, but otherwise he didn’t touch alcohol at all), and a mother who in general drank in moderation. This taught me to drink moderately, even when in environments where heavy drinking was the norm (high school etc.).

  17. I grew up thinking that my parents might have a drinking problem because they usually had a glass of wine with dinner, and my anti-drug program at school suggested that there was something wrong with that.

    On a lighter note than the rest of this, I remember getting into my dad’s car one morning when I was probably 7 or 8, looking at his travel mug of coffee, and saying as sanctimoniously as only a child (or a wingnut) can, “Daddy you shouldn’t drink and drive.” Cause, y’know, none of the PSAs ever specify that you shouldn’t drink alcohol and drive; I didn’t know that the particular beverage was important. 🙂

    Of course, to our kiddie tastebuds, it was so gross we never thought of alcohol as cool or glamorous or desirable.

    Yes, exactly. Like teaching kids that sex exists, but isn’t the be-all-end-all and does have its drawbacks and risks. Turning everything into a taboo just makes it all the more mysterious and alluring, at the same time as it robs kids of the knowledge to make smart decisions.

  18. Why is it okay to see Daddy with a beer in front of the TV, but not okay to see Mommy with a glass of wine in the backyard?

    It also depends on your basic position regarding drinking. There’s an anti-alcohol sentiment that’s gained a lot of strength in the past 10 years or so that views drinking, even in moderation, as immoral. Women, especially mothers, are seen in our society as the arbiters of moral behavior, whereas men are seen as morally flawed. So the assumption is that you just can’t expect that much of Daddy, because he’s only a man. Mommy, however, should be a paragon of virtue because she knows better. I guess you could call it the bigotry of high expectations.

  19. I don’t drink too often, so I don’t have much to add to that part of the article. I do want to say though that I want to applaud these moms for doing a very healthy thing in my opinion. By that I mean regularly getting together with each other to talk and have fun. It is healthy for them as well as the kids. I know how unhealthy it is to do nothing but stay at home and take care of the kids day in and day out without ever going anywhere or seeing anyone. That is the position I am in and have been in ever since I had my first kid nine years ago. I do try to get my friends together, but they are all too busy. I also have no money or car so I can’t go anywhere and meet anyone. I think the moms in the article are doing a great thing and I hope they don’t listen to the idiots that try to tell them otherwise.

    Dream

  20. It also depends on your basic position regarding drinking. There’s an anti-alcohol sentiment that’s gained a lot of strength in the past 10 years or so that views drinking, even in moderation, as immoral. Women, especially mothers, are seen in our society as the arbiters of moral behavior, whereas men are seen as morally flawed. So the assumption is that you just can’t expect that much of Daddy, because he’s only a man. Mommy, however, should be a paragon of virtue because she knows better. I guess you could call it the bigotry of high expectations.

    You realize this represents a regression, as opposed to anything new, right? Everything you just put forth in this quote is a pretty succinct description of views of women/mothers as moral gatekeepers and the heart of the home… from the 19th century.

    Eh. High expectations, low expectations, it’s still bigotry.

  21. I am careful with alcohol, it runs in my family, although, thankfully, my father who didn’t have an alcohol problem, raised us. The fact that my mother had one was a huge reason that she had piles of shit dumped on her during her divorce and nasty custody battle with my father. My mother is a highly gifted, intelligent and educated woman. Her inability to stay sober for any significant length of time most of her adult life has taken away more potential success than I can even imagine, much less her presence in my life growing up.

    To say I’m angry at the problem of alcoholism in this country would be an understatement, what with FAS and other attendant social problems.

    That said, this television piece shaming women serves no purpose other than what Herclitus and Beckabot already outline so well.

    I had concluded quite awhile ago that television news programs and other schlock serve no purpose other than to provide cheap entertainment by shoring up the patriarchy and constantly inventing incorrigible malcontents who threaten ‘our way of life’.

    That women (as news anchors) are complicit in this patriarchy playgame makes me sick beyond words.

  22. That’s just absurd. In a slightly tangential issue, I don’t know if this is happening over in the US, but there’s been a big deal lately about how ‘young women are binge drinking’. My partner’s a marketing academic with a particular interest in social marketing, and what’s really telling about the binge drinking literature is that it’s specified as more than four drinks in a session, without specifying the timeframe for a session. Which I think most of us can agree is absurd, given there’s a difference between 4 drinks in 4 minutes and 4 drinks in a 6-hour party/drinks night. Stephen made a point at one of the conference dinners that pretty much everyone besides him (he can’t drink because of allergies) would be classified as a binge drinker on the basis of their drinks consumed at the dinner.

  23. Waiiitt a minute…if I knew the right people, like the producers of ‘Today’, I could get my kid’s playgroup on TV? And all we have to do is sit around drinking, and talking smack about our wives/girlfriends’ business travel, while the kids play with Their Lil Ponies in the hostess’ room? Which we do every week anyway.

    I’m in. Except they would probably want to pitch it as, Lesbian Drunks Neglecting Their Children! Call CPS Today If You See One in Your Neighborhood!

    Feh.

  24. Women, especially mothers, are seen in our society as the arbiters of moral behavior, whereas men are seen as morally flawed. So the assumption is that you just can’t expect that much of Daddy, because he’s only a man. Mommy, however, should be a paragon of virtue because she knows better.

    I think this is where a lot of the “man-hating feminist” stuff comes from, also. For people who see men as inherently defective in a lot of ways (unable to cope without beer, inherently incapable of housework, humorously to dangerously incompetent with kids, so hormone driven that he can’t help ogling/harassing/groping/raping any woman who gets him too excited), blaming men for these kinds of faults looks like hatred. If you work from the idea that men are inherently weak in these ways but women aren’t then it looks unfair to blame them for their nature.

    Personally, I’d find the idea that men are all inherently defective, or by nature worse than women, pretty insulting by itself. And I think that if certain flaws and weaknesses aren’t an unavoidable part of anyone’s natural gender, then it’s reasonable to expect people who do have these flaws to work on them and improve.

    And considering that my kid brother’s the best cook in the family, so good with kids that he babysat in high school more than I did, and volunteered to go without drinking for nine months just to make things easier for his pregnant wife, I’m pretty skeptical of the “guys can’t help being like that” excuse.

  25. Zuzu, thank you again for not only introducing an important item to me — I hadn’t heard yet — but also doing such a great feminist critique of it. I’m working on a degree in media studies, and, so, this is helpful evidence to support several arguments about journalism, media bias, and gender. Love the two sentences below;

    >> ‘Why is it okay to see Daddy with a beer in front of the TV, but not okay to see Mommy with a glass of wine in the backyard?”

    >> “I’m talking about judging women more harshly for doing the same things that men do, and judging mothers most harshly of all.”

  26. “Yes, and this is something I probably should have expanded on in the post. Note that the reporter sets up the “double standard” as between a paid caretaker and the mother. Implication: the two are equivalent, and when the mother is on duty, she’s as much on the job as a paid babysitter. So drinking in front of the kids, for a mother, is equivalent to drinking on the job.”

    A double bind: As sociologists have found, women with male partners, whether they work outside the home or in the home primarily, do a disproportionate share of domestic labor, including the work that enables male leisure (e.g., fixing the food for the Super Bowl parties). Conflating the caretaking mother with a paid babysitter is outrageous in many ways, for example, because mothers are not compensated for this work and because it would further reinforce that mothers should always be available, should always be working and ‘there for their children.’ They are further commodified.

    It’s kind of, I don’t know the word, striking (?), that, this many years in second-wave feminism, we seem to still be reinforcing gender roles that seem stuck in the 50s (women are this, men are that; this domain, the private and the home, are for women; this domain, the public and the outside, are for men).

  27. I don’t drink too often, so I don’t have much to add to that part of the article. I do want to say though that I want to applaud these moms for doing a very healthy thing in my opinion. By that I mean regularly getting together with each other to talk and have fun. It is healthy for them as well as the kids. I know how unhealthy it is to do nothing but stay at home and take care of the kids day in and day out without ever going anywhere or seeing anyone. That is the position I am in and have been in ever since I had my first kid nine years ago. I do try to get my friends together, but they are all too busy. I also have no money or car so I can’t go anywhere and meet anyone. I think the moms in the article are doing a great thing and I hope they don’t listen to the idiots that try to tell them otherwise.

    That comment definitely hit home for me. My own mother got engaged in college, married the month after graduation, and was pregnant with my sister within six months. She never really had time to find a peer group where she was comfortable, and she never felt as comfortable with my dad’s (which is pretty understandable; he’s 20 years older than she is, so not only did he already have that group, but they didn’t have much in common with my mom). She has suffered greatly from depression for the last decade at least, and a lot of it is directly related to feeling isolated. She concentrated a lot on being “a good mother” to me and my sister (she quit a job she liked because she felt she wasn’t spending enough time with me) but rarely did anything simply because she enjoyed it, and now that we’re adults, she’s starting to really notice that lack, but isn’t sure how to go about finding people with similar interests to just…be friends with.

    It’s not really drinking related in her case (she drinks wine and fake-beer occasionally, but it’s pretty rare), but yeah: if she’d been able to, or encouraged to, connect with people around her outside of her family, she’d have had a lot more support/less cause of her depression. Having friends and relationships outside the family, whether or not a drink or two is part of that, is really important for mental health. And if these women find that in a group where their kids are also friends, that ends up being convenient for everyone involved.

  28. A retired model is being accused of being too fat, and moms shouldn’t drink.

    Only in America does this shit matter.

  29. So let me get this straight. Predominantly upper-middle-class women get together with their children and under the supervising gaze of multiple mothers these children play together. The women socialize in a congenial manner that involves small portions of alcohol for a limited amount of time and then they part and go about their days in a responsible matter. This activity has since stopped as all the children are now in school full-time. This is the wrong behaviour that is ripping society apart?

    The Today show needs to get real researchers if this is the best that they can do with all the bad behaviours that exist in the world. I suspect that the upper class twits that they hire are afraid to enter a “bad neighbourhood” because “here be monsters”. I know- I live in one of those neighbourhoods and if someone tried to pull that crap on one of our mothers, the beep machine wouldn’t be able to keep up as she called bullshit on the interviewer. Oh yeah, and she may not have arrived and looked the part that they had assigned her.

  30. Wow, So by the standards of this article, my wife and I have a terrible problem because we’ll both have a drink with dinner *gasp* IN FRONT OF THE CHILDREN!! Oh wait, it’s just my wife who has the problem because she’s “still on duty”. What a load of crap. As others have pointed out, what these moms are doing is healthy normal behavior. This article, and the attitudes behind it, are what is unhealthy.

  31. I’m confused. I always thought in the 1950s, the time supposedly so idolized by traditionalist wannabes, it was SOP for all the mothers in the neighborhood to get together to drink cocktails while the kids played. Does the “things were better way back when crowd” not even actually watch the TeeVee shows they mistake for the reality of those oh-so-innocent days of yore?

    As to drinking in front of the children: back in the day, kids drank a wee bit too, ya know.

  32. A little OT but:

    To this day, I can’t watch TV with the volume up, because that was one of the things that would wake him up and bring him downstairs in a violent rage.

    I do the same thing (it really irritates my friends) and I never made the asssociation before between my dad’s violent temper and watching tv with the volume down.

  33. In 1970’s suburbia, Atlanta, on Saturday afternoons we sat on our parents laps in the Jones’ back yard while the adults drank burbon and coke – sometimes I’d forget and drink some of my dad’s by mistake. When my parents were not doing that, they were sitting on my neighbors’ porch drinking highballs. No one would have DREAMED of critiquing this behavior, and if any of them HAD driven a car, a jury would have likely let them off (very hard to get a DUI conviction in those days). Last I checked, both sexes engaged in this equally. It’s exactly right that the woman is always on the job – kids or no. The house is her responsibility, and if it’s disorderly, its inhabitants hungry, or anything else there is amiss, it’s her fault. Never mind how many more children are killed each year by womens’ male partners than the other way around. Could we please talk about things that are a real danger to kids? However, let’s also look at the tiny bit of muck dug from the well of truth. It would not suprise me to learn that some mothers self medicate depression with alcohol. Could we please discuss hiring housekeepers and help for post partum depression instead of the blame game, please?

  34. bmc90- Could we please discuss hiring housekeepers and help for post partum depression instead of the blame game, please?

    No, nay, nein. Women must be towering pillars of strength, able to withstand any trial and tribulation while simultaneously seeming weak and compliant. We must mask our inner goddess in piles of chiffon silk and still care for our children, teaching the girls to be all pale and waiflike and the boys to be rambunctious but still quiet around their elders. At no time must we give a hint of doubt and we must be prepared to change our habits and routines at the first sign of societal change- usually passed on to us in the guise of morning “news” programs and afternoon talk shows. If a woman should somehow garner the Dr. before the Mrs., she must use it to ensure the compliance of all other females to this mythical norm to which we must all religiously adhere.

    Now I need to go teach my son how to pretend to be compliant to said norm.

  35. Reading this reminded me of the recent suggestion that women who may possibly one day have children need to treat their bodies as constantly pre-pregnant. Both that and this segment of the Today show are similar in that they treat women as nothing but baby machines with the sole purpose of birthing and raising the next generation.

    It’s always seemed to be an irrational argument that I’ve seen often in comments from the right about women staying in bad marriages for the children. Basically, that women should sacrifice their happiness to give their children the “best” (in the author’s opinion) childhood so they can grow up to sacrifice their happiness… and on and on.

  36. I got the impression from the whole msn thing that they were trying to create an almost valley of the dolls sort of thing….
    or sad lonely suburban housemoms wacked out on valium…that sort of thing…

  37. A close family friend growing up got into her neursurgery residency by producing a certificate to the chief stating that she had had her tubes tied. I’m afraid we are going back to those days in a big hurry. If you want to pursue certain opportunities as a woman, you have to prove that you won’t be “distracted” by motherhood (of course men can have 10 kids if they want, no problem) and that your body is not available as a vessel.

  38. my professional experience with the double standard:

    if a man has a substance abuse issue, during a divorce, his wife will get custody and he will have no problem securing visitation as long as he does not physically abuse them.

    if a woman has a substance abuse issue (and this can just mean her husband says she drinks too much or reports that she puffs an occasional joint), the father will get custody and the woman will not be able to have visitation unless she can prove 3 months clean and sober AND her sex life will be severely monitored and discussed in court.

    i had a client who brought her baby-father to court for domestic violence, he mentioned she occasionally smokes marijuana before she goes to bed while grandma watches the kids (she’s 23), and she was informed she would have to enroll in a detox and attend NA if she wanted to keep custody.
    nevermind that he racks up DUIs like no one’s business.

    of course, i’m not saying it’s cool to be an alcoholic mom, but i do think women are expected to be MOM 24/7, while dad’s are almost expected to have a night out with the guys, drinking, playing pool, frequenting Hooters, etc. and it’s fucked.

  39. The seriously fun part is that a lot of people are driven to substance abuse by – guess what – spousal abuse! Because the abuser does not WANT you to get sober. The abuser is not going to be driving their victim to any AA meetings either. As a drunk, the abuser can always claim that the drunk was out of control and craaaazy. Plus sober people are better on the witness stand when trying to get protective orders, interviewing for jobs, catching the bus out of town, etc.

  40. Thank god there’s actually some reasonable discussion going on about this, and not the rote finger-pointing that I’ve encountered.

    After I became a single mother, I ended up feeling forced to give up my glass of wine with my weekend dinners, as well as the occasional bottle of beer I would enjoy while hanging out with friends. Note the singular: *A* glass of wine, *A* bottle of beer. There is so much judgement about this! I’ve faced countless other mothers who called me — essentially — a bad parent (though they all used phrases like “well, I just think it’s a little Irresponsible to drink around kids”) just for having a single freaking alcoholic drink.

    Unfortunately this attitude is so pervasive that it *does* threaten single parents who hold custody of their children… and it does instill the fear in parents that Someone Will Do Something (read in, Maybe CPS — which is what I and many of my other alternamama friends are always wary of).

    As yet another person who grew up in a home with alcoholic parents, it disgusts me that people see that as being the same as me having a glass of red wine. Or these other mothers having a cocktail at a playdate.

    People – WOMYN – can drink responsibly. As the very first poster mentioned, it’s important for our kids to see that’s possible, rather than having a complete ban on alcohol; how else will they learn to be responsible in a similar situation?

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