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Sick.

via Michael comes this revolting blog post from Rachel Moran, a nice Florida girl who thinks that the homeless are sub-human and should be physically assaulted for having the audacity to speak to her. No, really:

We are thinking about proving this nuisance and need for civil action by making a short film called “Eddie Rolls on the Homeless,” whereby Mark secretly videotapes me and Lil Sis in a variety of situations to see how many homeless people approach us and, then, how many of these situations escalate into harrassment. Then, he’s gonna videotape Eddie in the same scenarios, only Eddie is going to beat up every homeless person who escalates the contact after being told that his panhandling is illegal and annoying.

You’re planning on beating up homeless people on video and it’s panhandling that’s illegal and wrong?

I suspect that Rachel and her friends are under the impression that beating someone up in response to verbal harassment is self defense. She may have a problem demonstrating that in court, though, when her idea to attract as many homeless people as possible and then physically assault them is published on the internet, and the crime is videotaped.

I resent street harassment as much as any feminist (or any woman, for that matter). I support calling men out on their bad behavior. And if a man attempts to assault someone, I hope his would-be victim puts him in the ER. But I certainly don’t support unprovoked assault, or attacking someone because he asked for money or responded when you told him that he’s a lazy bum who should go to Hell.

But then, this Rhodes Scholar’s problem doesn’t seem to be with harassment. It’s with the very existence of these filthy street “people” in her city.

At the table, Eddie was a little heated still and started to tell another story about how he had beaten up some other homeless guy.

We have decided that the homeless problem in St. Petersburg is becoming entirely out of control. Part of the problem is that a bunch of idiot liberal ‘Burgers will just stand there and let homeless people ramble on at them and then fumble for money or let themselves get yelled at when they don’t have any. I seriously know girls who are, like, afraid of downtown during certain times now, which is horrendous, because, for Christ’s sake, this is St. Petersburg, not Manhattan.

As someone who lives in Manhattan, I’ll point out that the homeless aren’t particularly threatening. Homelessness is a social problem, and it needs to be dealt with — but not by treating homeless people like stray dogs. The majority of homeless people are only homeless for one day. Rachel is talking about the chronic homeless, the people who usually suffer from serious mental health problems or physical addictions. The chronic homeless need ongoing support, not an overburdened shelter system which, for all of its good intentions, is limited to pushing them through a revolving door. And they certainly don’t need a narcissistic fuckwit blogger and her sociopath friends attacking them.

Now if you’ll excuse me, I have to courageously fend off Manhattan’s homeless minions as I walk downtown to get dinner.

Michael encourages you to contact the St. Petersburg police.


79 thoughts on Sick.

  1. Haha, I love that she has a friend who has beaten up multiple homeless guys. WTF is wrong with people…

  2. You’ve got to be pretty pathetic/miserable to pick on chronically homeless people. As if they don’t have it hard enough.

  3. Ms. Moron (oops, was it Moran?) should come to Portland and then tell me that St. Petersburg has a lot of homeless people. While she’s at it, she should sit down and talk to a kid who ran away from an abusive family, a disabled person who has been discriminated out of work, and one of the any number of people just like her who are victims of bad freaking luck. It’s much harder to dehumanize people whose stories you’ve heard, but sadly, I think that the inconvenience to her would still outweigh all the other factors.

    How is “too many homeless people” the fault of the people themselves and not the government (local and larger) and society that leaves them to the streets?

  4. You know, I think her profile tells me everything I might ever have wanted to know.

    Hi! I’m the American Dream – 5’10”, 36-26-36, shiny hair, blue eyes and a smile. I wear fur and diamonds. I dance like a dream. I make you happy.

    No, actually, you make me despair for all of humanity.

  5. That makes my list of one of the worst blog posts of all time. Seriously, why don’t they just get together with the Bumfights asshole and make a movie? And by “make a movie” what I really mean is “walk off a cliff and explode.”

  6. And while I try not to throw up, doesn’t she know that someone’s already tried this concept in Bumfights?

  7. That profile makes me wonder how accurate she is about anything she’s telling us. I rather doubt that her buddy actually beat up all those homeless guys like he said he did.

    But, if she’s real and wants to videotape herself and her friends committing crimes, well, somewhere a DA is smiling.

  8. No, actually, you make me despair for all of humanity.

    Word. Where do you even start with this?

    I rather doubt that her buddy actually beat up all those homeless guys like he said he did.

    I actually don’t doubt her buddy has beat up homeless guys previously; I am sad to say I’ve known guys who’ve done that, though they referred to it as “rolling bums” and robbery was one of the motives. (Ask me whether they were entitled little snots who thought the world owed them a million cheap thrills a minute.) This guy just sounds like he’s papered over his sense of entitlement with some aspiring vigilante horseshit, is all.

  9. i love her justification of violence–that her friend’s the only one who’s *actually* beat up a homeless person, and it’s okay, because he was homeless before. i think she has the “do unto others” concept a little skewed…

  10. What’s most deeply disturbing about this post is that Florida has had a highly-publicized murder case in the headlines for a year about teens in Ft. Lauderdale who murdered some homeless guys last year. Instead of waking up Floridians to a very disturbing lack of humanity in its younger generation, the incident only appears to have inspired copycat crimes of hatred:

    http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/16441434.htm

    I live about 30 minutes from St. Petersburg and what probably inspired this insipid creature was this public protest over the police slashing the tents of homeless people in 2 “tent cities” today:

    http://www.baynews9.com/content/36/2007/1/19/216636.html?title=City+cuts+homeless+residents%27+tents+down

    This is an ongoing conflict in our state. The wealthy retirees and the middle-aged gated-community dwellers are becoming increasingly hostile to the poor, the working class, and the homeless here. They want their lawns cared for, their children raised, their laundry, cooking, cleaning, and beauty care provided cheaply, but they don’t want those of us who do these things to live among them nor do they want us hobnobbing or socializing with them either.

    Property values, taxes, and insurance have all but taken care of that. A recent study I read (sorry, can’t find that link) suggested that in another decade or so, us working class folk here in Florida will face a commute over an hour since we will not be able to afford to live anywhere near where we actually work.

    That their children now view the homeless, even the ones who are veterans and mentally ill, as sub-human is not surprising at all to me, though it makes me fear for the future of my home state.

  11. Ilyka, I’m not saying “nobody really does that so he couldn’t have”. But there are also a lot of people who like to brag about how bad-ass they are when they’ve never done anything more dangerous than swing a Wii controller.

  12. Gimme a break. I live in New York. You want to talk homeless? Let’s talk about a social and economic and political system that is totally broken and can’t give these people the help and support they need to live. And now this idiot and her friends are going to beat up the homeless? I appreciate what Priscilla said above; I think that the issue of property values and the working class in many communities is really important.

  13. Of course the homeless are threatening. They might cause the shell she’s built around her rusted conscience to crack a little, and human emotion might filter through.

    Can’t have that. Oh no.

  14. Does she really work for the Tampa Review, a literary magazine for the University of Tampa, as one of the commentors said? Because it’s tempting to forward the link to the University’s ethics department.

  15. “The truth is vagrants travel to cities where there is a structure to support them. How many homeless people are rolling up on couples on dates in, I don’t know, the downtown of a suburb of Indianapolis? How many girls in their twenties are afraid of walking alone in the well-lit areas of suburban Des Moines? ”

    Wow.

    The truth is that in many cities where there is a cluster of resources and shelters for the homeless, it’s because people like Rachel “Ivanka” Moran shuffles them off into a corner in the first place via the old “I don’t care where you go but it’s gotta be the hell away from here!”

  16. Some choices quotes from her blog:

    I have a coworker who is straight up in love with me.

    …while all of this was happening, one of the contracted garbage men decided he liked me, too.

    And then she writes about how she’s abandoning an animal ’cause she doesn’t “like” it anymore.

    Wow.

    I mean, I’ve written up some pretty dumb shit on blogs before (yes, even about how much I hated a certain fat girl at the gym – mostly because she reminded me of my loathsome roommate, not that I would admit it), but even I can’t compete with this splendour.

  17. Ms. Moron (oops, was it Moran?)

    Ahem. Not like I ever heard that before, sharing that name. Soooo original.

    WTF is she wearing fur in St. Petersburg for?

  18. The sad thing is I’ve actually heard people having these kinds of conversations in restaurants. For anyone who never understood why everyone else in the Bay Area hated the dotcom kids so much, picture a male version of Ms Moran in a stripey shirt.
    Also seconding Comandante Agi’s comment – Olberman would love this.

  19. Eh, I dunno, I think you are reading WAY more into a blog post than you should. Moran said homeless, but a lot of people replying here aren’t making any distinction that I think is obvious. Moran wasn’t talking about the people who are homeless for a day, or the people who have small kids and are working their asses off, etc. etc. She was talking about some guy who tried to molest her sister.

    Don’t deny that there’s a subdivision of homeless people that like to hurt other people, because I live in the city and I’ve got a lot of experience with it. The kind that starts following you down the street when you say sorry, no change, screaming that you’re a fucking cunt and should be shot. What, that hasn’t happened to you? It’s happened to me. Or the one that waits until you walk by and tries to grab your breasts. That’s happened to me, too. What’s your response to that? “hey, they’re homeless, so you have no right to be angry at that person” ?

    I’ve been kicked by one of the local homeless. One has tried to grab my hair on the Skytrain. (I live in Vancouver. I’m sure you’re wondering.) I’ve had one come up and start screaming right in my ear that “(you’re) a fucking fuck fuck,” on my 7:00 a.m. morning walk to the skytrain. It was pitch dark out and there weren’t any cars on the road. He didn’t touch me, but I was really scared. Can I admit that I’m pretty sure he was high, or does that make me evil, white, entitled and privileged? Does it matter if he was white or black?

    And no, I wasn’t leaving Starbucks with $600 in my pocket, and yes, I actually do wish that homeless person WAS DEAD. Hear that? I don’t hate single moms, or black single dads, or teen lesbians, or german runaways, and I don’t get that from moran’s post, either, but I am afraid of a particular subset of homeless people because I’ve had some really bad experiences with them, and I am angry with them.

    I am still angry/scared enough of some homless people that I have joked with friends about going out and shooting them. No one has ever assumed I must mean all homeless people. The distinction is implied in her post and it’s really obvious.

    And, since I’m here, not that I wear fur but what’s the difference between fur and leather? If both require you to kill the animal, morally, does it matter to you that you use all of it’s parts or just some?

  20. Oh my god. This woman is truly sick. I’m not a psychologist, or even a psychology student, but it’s obvious that she’s mentally ill. Her lack of empathy will be only too ironic when she’s standing in doorways herself, yelling at passing cars, and asking your date for a dollar.

  21. Huh. I had an accident on my scooter last week on the way to work. It was the homeless people downtown who came, asked me if I needed assistance, then peeled me off the pavement and set my bike upright again.

  22. Moran wasn’t talking about the people who are homeless for a day, or the people who have small kids and are working their asses off, etc. etc. She was talking about some guy who tried to molest her sister.

    Don’t deny that there’s a subdivision of homeless people that like to hurt other people, because I live in the city and I’ve got a lot of experience with it. The kind that starts following you down the street when you say sorry, no change, screaming that you’re a fucking cunt and should be shot. What, that hasn’t happened to you? It’s happened to me. Or the one that waits until you walk by and tries to grab your breasts. That’s happened to me, too. What’s your response to that? “hey, they’re homeless, so you have no right to be angry at that person” ?

    She, and you, are making no distinction between the individual who did the harrassing and the group that person belongs to. Sorry, still sick.

  23. laszlo, she’s not talking about finding and beating up a guy who tried to molest her sister. She’s talking about attacking random homeless people.

    I am still angry/scared enough of some homless people that I have joked with friends about going out and shooting them.

    The person who attacked you was probably mentally ill. Do you “joke” with your friends about going out and shooting the mentally ill?

    The person who attacked you was a man. Do you “joke” with your friends about going out and shooting men?

    I’m not mocking you for what happened to you, because that’s so obviously terrible that it shouldn’t even need to be said. But you sound as though you (quite understandably) are still traumatized by it–and fantasizing about killing anyone homeless is probably not the best way to handle it.

  24. Sorry y’all, gotta side with laszlo on this. I don’t think this Moran woman sounds like the world’s biggest brain trust or the Keeper of Empathy, either. But come on. And zuzu, I am very surprised to see you dismiss laszlo’s very valid points. She IS making a distinction; she said so right in her comment.

    I also don’t appreciate the continued stigmatization of mental illness from Jenny Dreadful.

  25. laszlo, first, I’ve had similar experiences with some homeless myself. Yes, they are scary. Yes, they are traumatizing. It’s perfectly normal for you to feel those things.

    I want to point out a huge difference between what you wrote and what Robin Moran wrote. You wrote that you have JOKED about going out and shooting homeless people (I assume you’re not talking about random homeless people, but ones who harass or grope you). She has said that she and her friends are going to go out and actually, physically BEAT UP on homeless people.

    There is a huge difference between thought and action. The action is violent, sick, and, in fact, criminal. The appropriate response to verbal harassment is not physical assault. If someone tries to assault you, then it is legitimately self defense to assault them back (with a reasonable degree of force).

    Furthermore, we have to, as a society, decide how we want to deal with people who have untreated serious mental illnesses and no support system. The majority of homeless who scream at and chase after people have untreated serious mental illnesses. 45 years ago, these are people who would most likely have been in absolutely horrendous state mental institutions. Not all people with serious mental illnesses have families or friends who either can and/or are willing to support them (either physically and/or emotionally). In the absence of any kind of government support, people with serious illnesses but without a support system often wind up on the street. [There are also instances where the person just disappears, even though the family wants to support them.]

    How do we want to deal with this? We decided 40 years ago that putting people in horrific conditions in state institutions was a bad idea. However, we then defaulted to “it’s all the family’s problem,” without any thought for what would happen with families who do not have the resources or the desire to care for people with severe mental illnesses. The only options available are not “horrible state insitutions” or “family’s problem.”

    While I understand that it’s frightening to be confronted with someone who is screaming obscenities at you or chasing after you, chances are that they can’t help it. Just expecting them to stop is futile. Look, my own mother is bipolar. About 10 years ago, she suffered from delusions. My father didn’t know how to deal with it, so he would just tell her to stop being irrational. I’ll say now what I said to him then. You can’t tell a person who is delusional to stop being irrational. It doesn’t work that way. If they could, they wouldn’t be having delusions in the first place. It’s useless. You have to get them treatment. So two psychiatrists later, we got my mother the treatment she needed, and since then, as long as she’s taking her medication, she’s been fine.

    So believe me, I understand the fear. I understand the anger. It’s OK to be angry, just as long as you recognize that the anger itself is irrational. The person can’t just stop it, so we shouldn’t expect them to. We should expect that we figure out a way to properly treat people with serious mental illnesses that doesn’t put all the burden on families. If we’re not willing to do that, then we should be willing to live with the consequences.

  26. “But come on” is not really a substantive, persuasive rebuttal, Amber.

    Nobody is saying that laszlo ought to go around hugging random homeless people. But this blogger is saying that she wants to videotape beating up homeless people who are aggressively panhandling.

  27. To the person who pointed out that moran is talking about attacking people begging for change, okay, you’re right, I was projecting (a bit, and I’m not the only one here guilty of that.)

    Jenny dreadful – elaborate? I’m still here reading. If there were alligators on the streets that attacked you, why wouldn’t you be able to want them gone?

  28. Laszlo, homeless people are not wild animals, and are unlikely to attack or kill you for food or territory. The danger posed by a homeless person is not comparable to the danger posed by an alligator, because homeless people are not inherently dangerous.

  29. If there were alligators on the streets that attacked you, why wouldn’t you be able to want them gone?

    Would you please elaborate on that yourself? What is the appropriate solution, in your view? I’m having a hard time reading that in a positive manner, but I’d rather you specify precisely what you mean before I comment further.

  30. She was talking about some guy who tried to molest her sister.

    She started by talking about one guy who tried to touch her sister’s hair. It’s hard to say without knowing the circumstances whether beating him up would have been appropriate, but shouting at him to back off until he did seems reasonable.

    Then she moved onto “the homeless,” which is really very much like getting mugged by a black guy and blaming all black men. Or a certain ‘type’ of black guy that such as men who don’t dress obviously middle-class.

    What’s your response to that? “hey, they’re homeless, so you have no right to be angry at that person” ?

    You have every right to be angry at someone who harasses, threatens, or grabs you. But blaming ‘that kind’ or ‘that type’ is exactly what prejudice and bigotry are.

    I once had a French guy follow me down the street, say all kinds of sexual vulgarities that he thought I couldn’t understand, explicitly threaten to drag me in an alley and do me “up the ass, like in prison,” and finally block my path while shouting, “Fuck me!” in English. Doesn’t mean I hate all French guys, or that I go around with a mental picture of a certain ‘type’ of Frenchmen, fantasizing about how they need to die.

    Can I admit that I’m pretty sure he was high, or does that make me evil, white, entitled and privileged? Does it matter if he was white or black?

    First, the word you’re struggling for is prejudiced. Second, it’s entirely fair to say that you’re pretty sure some guy was high based on actually dealing with him. It’s when you get to “most of those people are high” that prejudice comes in.

    Third, nobody cares if your white, and nobody wants to blame you for it. I’ll be a flaming hypocrite if I started holding other people’s whiteness against them, as well as a bigot and an idiot for picking my own color to hate. And being privileged doesn’t make you bad. I can’t say from your post if you’re privileged or not, but the word just means someone with more advantanges than others. Like parents who can get kids into the good schools, and families who can arrange expensive treatment and ongoing medication for the mentally ill, two advantages that relatively few homeless people have. I consider myself privileged, and that doesn’t make me a bad person. It just means I need to remember not to mistake other people being less lucky than me for moral failings on their part.

    I am still angry/scared enough of some homless people that I have joked with friends about going out and shooting them. No one has ever assumed I must mean all homeless people. The distinction is implied in her post and it’s really obvious.

    One good tip one of my writing teachers gave me about persuasion; declaring something’s obvious instead of explaining it merely highlights how it isn’t.

    I’m curious though, about this subset you’re talking about. Is it just the ones who harassed and threatened you? Because if you want to fantasize about shooting people who harass you, fair enough.

    Or is it a certain ‘type’? Something you can tell just by looking at them? One of those ‘everybody knows’ things? Because that kind of stuff is really dangerous. That’s where racial profiling sneaks in. And even if you leave out race, it’s still not terribly fair to pick the ones who are dirty, have odd body language, or whatever else you base it off of, and treat them all the way you’d treat someone who threatened or attacked you. It’s not as big of a deal when you’re just entertaining thoughts or joking, but I don’t know that Rachel Moran is anything but serious. It’s not obvious to me. I’ve been trying to figure out if I could email the St. Petersburg police, since I’m not in Florida, and I honestly think they need to investigate this woman. I think she and her friends are a public safety threat, the same way some guy grabbing women’s breasts on the street is.

  31. I’m very curious about laszlo comparing homeless people to alligators. In fact, I have no idea how to respond to that.

    I read through several of her posts, and I think she’s a sociopath. The post about her abandoning an animal that she “didn’t like” any longer made my fucking blood boil.

    I generally give money to homeless people when they ask. In the area where I live, the city is always “cracking down” on the vagrant population. It’s ridiculous–in Arizona, in the summertime, the elements crack down on them quite enough. Last summer, hundreds of homeless people died in the heat. When someone asks me for some spare change, my privelege smacks me in the face, and I suddenly feel deeply ashamed. It makes me angry when people react angrily to someone’s plea for cash–“How dare you remind me that there are people going hungry right under my nose?”

  32. If there were alligators on the streets that attacked you,

    Alligators are predators and are inherently dangerous to humans; there is no such thing as a ‘harmless’ alligator. Are you saying that homeless people are biologically hardwired to be predators with no possibility of being around other humans safely?

  33. Y’know, when someone compares the homeless or mentally ill to something like an alligator, it seems to me that they’re saying homeless or mentally ill people aren’t people in need of treatment and help, but dangerous animals who should be put down or locked up so that they’re not scary any more.

    That attitude scares me more than creepy homeless guys who oughta be in treatment but aren’t.

  34. A while back, my mom found out that a distant relative of mine was sleeping on a park bench. She was, basically, your stereotypical dirty, scary, raving homeless person. And because I know this person’s life story, I really believe that scary-seeming, threatening-seeming homeless people end up that way because of a combination of serious mental illness and serious lack of family support. My relative is both mentally ill and mildly cognitively disabled, and she was orphaned as a very small child. Her one close relative, her grandfather, died just after she aged out of the foster care system, a situation that would have been hard for someone who didn’t have her other challenges. And you know, I don’t know if she did drugs. She may have: a lot of mentally ill people self-medicate. But I know for a fact that drugs are not her primary problem.

    I am not denying that it can be disturbing to deal with untreated mentally ill people. But they are not the alligators in this situation. They’re a lot more likely to be victims of violence than perpetrators of it. They’re probably more scared than you are, both of real dangers and often of dangers that exist only in their minds. Anyone who has been living on the street for any length of time has very likely experienced assault that’s a whole lot more serious than someone touching their hair. They are the vulnerable ones in this scenario. The alligators are the rest of us, who have allowed this state of affairs to exist.

    My mom was able to help my relative get into a group home, but it was really hard. At some point, she asked a social worker what happened to most people in my relative’s situation, and the social worker said that most often they end up in prison. There’s something really deeply wrong with that. It’s not “de-institutionalization” if you get rid of mental hospitals and end up putting people in prisons.

  35. laszlo:

    I live in Vancouver too. I spent last year living in DOWNTOWN Vancouver. Where I have had someone scare me into buying him whatever he wanted from London Drugs (mind, not all was food and what was edible was candy). For reference, I was a student then making $600/mo where my rent was $300.

    I understand what you’re saying when you talk about being scared of the people who approach you. Some of the people I was approached by on a VERY regular basis were threatening. Most were not.

    Did I want to go out and shoot them all? No. I crossed the street when I saw them coming/noted a posture taken to other passersby and then cursed the people in government that closed down the mental institution in Kamloops/dropped funding for Riverview and just tossed these people out the gates.

    I mean we’d all like to reduce the visibility of the homeless, I’m sure. But no matter how much I wish that I did not have to be nervous while walking to my bus stop or made guilty for not usually carrying change (and here I don’t mean to come off as holier than thou) I always found it really tough to blame the actual people that were stalking the street. Because I’m positive that if they have better options, there’s no way in hell that they would be on the streets harassing the “soft targets” (I’m sure that’s what I look like to them) for day-to-day living.

  36. Interesting discussion here, what with alligators being brought in, and all. We actually do have the occasional alligator on the sidewalk scenario here and the alligators are usually trapped, tied up, and sent to the Everglades.

    The homeless in St. Pete, however, were forced to stand by and watch the St. Pete police take knives and cut up the tents they were living in early yesterday morning because they were a “fire hazard”, what with cooking and smoking inside them. Makes perfect sense, doesn’t it? Take people who live outdoors with few possessions to start with (and most certainly would qualify as mentally ill, I would imagine) in a city that doesn’t have even 1/5 the number of shelter beds for them to sleep on and destroy their homes, offering no alternative.

    Luckily, many St. Pete residents were horrified and showed up today with new tents, fire exstinguishers, no smoking signs, and food. Not a permanent solution but it certainly sent the message that, unlike Ms. Moran, they don’t just want the homeless to be exterminated or disappeared, but rather recognize that they are fellow human beings in dire need of help, no matter how annoying or threatening.

    The trend of Florida teenagers seeing the homeless, whether mentally ill, “lazy and dirty”, drug or alcohol addicted, veteran, or recently bankrupt, as subhuman nuisances who deserve to be tormented, tortured, and killed for pleasure is a symptom of a sick political and social philosophy that is eroding the greatness of our nation. The “welfare queen in a Cadillac car” and the “shiftless, lazy, no-good homeless leech” themes are part and parcel of that philosophy with no good grounding in the complex reality social problems.

    I am no Christianist but I do revere the words of their God: “And whatever you do to the least of these, my brethren, you do also unto me.” Seems like a pretty cut-and-dried approach to tackling social ills like homelessness to me.

    And for the record, if you read all of Ms. Moran’s postings, having a gang of young men surround and beat on a homeless man who was backing away does not sound like a reasonable reaction to me any more than forming a gang to “hunt them down” does. As the Ft. Lauderdale area murders show, it’s far too easy for these teen marauders to take it to the next step and simply start killing.

  37. I read an article in the New Yorker awhile back about a program (I think in Denver–definitely Colorado, though) that gave small studio apartments and a stipend to people known to be chronically homeless, no strings attached. As in, they didn’t have to promise anything to get a key. No forced drug rehab, no forced alchohol rehab, no religious expectations, no rules to obey or be kicked out. Just, “here’s a key to a place where you can live.”

    They found a number of surprising things. That it actually cost less to give someone a a room with a kitchenette than it did to pay for their emergency room bills when they’d get sick from sleeping in the elements–sometimes as much as 180k/year less for the people who usually ended up in the hospitals most (it cost about 20k for the room, as I recall). That 40% of the people who accepted the rooms went on to take their medications regularly, to shower regularly, and went on to get part time jobs that allowed them to pay back into the the program a little.

    They also found that this particular community was extremely resistant to the idea of just plain old giving people no-strings-attached rooms because of the pervasive belief that these chronically homeless people must have done something to deserve it, that they should have to prove themselves worthy for the money.

    It seems to me a program like this one is win-win-win:

    1)It costs the rest of us less tax money because we’re not paying as much for the police/doctors/emergency technicians
    2)It frees up room in shelters for the vast majority of homeless who are temporarily homeless
    3)It gets chronic homeless out of that downward spiral and out of the outside

    It seems as if a solution (if not this one) is there, if our society was really willing to look at the problem objectively.

    Incidentally, around here (downtown san diego) it seems like the most desperate people are not the ones panhandling. They’re the ones just sitting there, barely existing.

  38. For anyone interested, this is the article Kaytie’s talking about. It is a very interesting piece — one of my all-time New Yorker favorites.

  39. Kaytie, there’s a somewhat similar program called Care Not Cash that’s been implemented in San Francisco. It’s hardly perfect, but it’s not as though the homeless are going to get apartments by saving up enough bottle-return money to pay for a security deposit.

  40. I think I need a moment before I can respond with anything other than curses.

    Why does it take so much to explain that other human beings are other human beings, and not toys and targets and things worth no consideration?

  41. Kaytie, there’s a somewhat similar program called Care Not Cash that’s been implemented in San Francisco. It’s hardly perfect, but it’s not as though the homeless are going to get apartments by saving up enough bottle-return money to pay for a security deposit.

    I thought Care Not Cash was different–the name for a set of policies that substitute shelters etc. for cash benefits. Kaytie’s talking about a housing policy, but a slightly different one–one that puts housing ahead of everything else rather than requiring homeless people to stabilize themselves before they can have the kind of stability that shelter provides.

  42. The homeless in St. Pete, however, were forced to stand by and watch the St. Pete police take knives and cut up the tents they were living in early yesterday morning because they were a “fire hazard”, what with cooking and smoking inside them.

    A year or so ago, SF police were criticized for their extremely liberal interpretation of “abandoned,” one which stretched to include carts and camp areas that were clearly being used as home bases by homeless people.

  43. piny, it is a different program, but the idea behind it is the same–people who are homeless need homes. Obviously, that’s not all they need. But living on the streets obviously makes it a lot harder for other solutions to work.

  44. Thanks for posting that New Yorker link, Jill, that was some good reading. It’s sad to think that the financial bottom line prompted action when simple compassion has not, but it’s good to see solutions built on the crazy idea that the homeless are people and people need homes.

  45. laszlo:

    I also live in Vancouver, and while I’ve had a few scary encounters, the vast majority of the homeless are harmless. The old guy on Granville street with the harmonica, the duck ladies, the 25-cent lady, hell, even the guy who says he’s Jesus, all of are harmless. If you’re going to be angry at someone, be angry at our government, which closed the institutions, ejecting hundreds of mentally ill people onto the street. Who slashed social programs to almost non-existance. Who is currently spending millions of dollars on the Olympics. Remember, our premier is the same man who, while mayor, would not lift a finger to investigate the disappearance of women from the downtown eastside, but who posted a reward to catch the person who was setting fire to garages in Kerrisdale. That’s who you should be blaming.

  46. What’s most deeply disturbing about this post is that Florida has had a highly-publicized murder case in the headlines for a year about teens in Ft. Lauderdale who murdered some homeless guys last year. Instead of waking up Floridians to a very disturbing lack of humanity in its younger generation, the incident only appears to have inspired copycat crimes of hatred

    Yes, we had a case in Australia recently where the homeless guy – who was actually regarded with quite a lot of affection in his local (rural) community – was burned alive by a group of kids, in his cardboard / wood shanty.

    Posts like Rachel’s can only give encouragement to that kind of thing.

  47. Woah, Eddie’s doin’ it again, down at Mastry’s wowing the lady-types with his great tough-guy stories. About this one time this street guy dissed his girl, and Eddie kicked his ass. Hey, ladies, I’ve got some great fight stories to tell too! Mostly centered on my two tours in ‘Nam, all about them gooks that I ruthlessly tore their asses up.

    Of course, I never actually went to Vietnam. Have a real nice day, Eddie!

    (St. Petersburg is full of wankers.)

  48. Oh, incidentally, so you’ll know what’s up with the weird police thuggery in St. Petersburg (rolling up in their Police Interceptors and slicing the tops off of tents with knives!), here’s the real deal, the insider’s skinny.. See, there’s this one particular tract of land, about two-thirds of a city block with a total area of about 1.7 acres, which up until two months ago was occupied by a couple dozen run-down old wooden houses, subdivided into weekly rental apartments. They got bought out by developers and last month they knocked all the houses down. (Rats scattered everywhere. One ended up in our department secretary’s office.) There were already a few homeless people hanging out on the street in that neighborhood; with the demolition of that block of cheap rentals the number of homeless people in this vicinity tripled. This block is right on the geographical edge of the latest phase of the ongoing gentrification of downtown St. Petersburg. What used to be a block of lowest-of-the-low cheap rentals will soon be $25-million-plus worth of urban townhouses (65 or so units, starting in the low $400s).

    Move on, hurry up, hurry up, move on, you bums. Got it? Get it? Just as rain falls down to earth from Heaven, everything follows that number 2.5e7, C.R.E.A.M.

    I’ve worked in an office of the other third of that block for twenty years now. I’m often the last to leave the office, and I have never once been harassed or felt scared, because the bums in this area are the most inoffensive bums imaginable. In fact, when I’m working extra-late and I’m locking the office front door I always feel a little relieved to see a few people on the sidewalks; I figure I’ve got less of a chance of being a robbery victim when there are witnesses hanging out. I suppose I’ve bought quite a few beers for those guys over the years. I mean, when a guy comes up to me and asks for spare change, I’m not half enough of an asshole to say “no.” Though Eddie sure is! But as everybody knows, Eddie’s a dick. And. of course, if contrary to my expectation, there actually is an afterlife and a Judgment and all that jazz, I’m sure those beers will amount to the best part of my self-exculpation and plea for Heavenly mercy.

  49. Life is a struggle for everyone. Why is it that some people are allowed to give up that struggle and expect others to carry them, while the rest go on trying to do their best with what life hands them?

    Why are people considered unempathetic if they find their own burdens sufficient and do not wish to (or cannot) take on the additional burdens of those who have given up in one way or another? We won’t demand that a person carry his own burden, but we turn around and demand that others carry the burdens of two, themselves and random strangers who approach them on the street. That doesn’t seem right to me.

    You can chastise laszlo but heaven forbid anyone should chastise a homeless person. Why are they privileged when it comes to personal responsibility? Why are they permitted to attack others, but no one is permitted to attack them except in extreme self-defense? Why is this woman you are all discussing not accorded the same charity for her “mental condition” as you are according the random homeless? Where is the charity toward her?

    You people are somewhat ridiculous. If you are not going to judge those on the street, you forfeit the right to judge on the web as well.

  50. Why is it that some people are allowed to give up that struggle and expect others to carry them

    You mean why are some people allowed to struggle with untreated mental illnesses with no support system whatsoever while living on the streets? Or why do we blame people with drug addictions as moral failures and refuse to fund the treatment programs that will help them?

  51. Why is it that some people are allowed to give up that struggle and expect others to carry them, while the rest go on trying to do their best with what life hands them?

    No one’s “allowed” or “forbidden” to give up. Some people just get stuck, temporarily or permanently. They pull themselves out, get pulled out by others, or sink and die. Everyone can quit and hope someone else will carry them along, but almost no one will do this deliberately because of the risks of being left without help.

    Why are people considered unempathetic if they find their own burdens sufficient and do not wish to (or cannot) take on the additional burdens of those who have given up in one way or another? We won’t demand that a person carry his own burden, but we turn around and demand that others carry the burdens of two, themselves and random strangers who approach them on the street.

    It’s not about failing to help the homeless, or about not wanting to hand out money. If someone can’t or won’t go on, you don’t have to carry their burden, or them the whole way. But it’s common decency not to trample them as you pass, and the least we could expect not to stomp on their fallen bodies, screaming a them for blocking the path.

    You can chastise laszlo but heaven forbid anyone should chastise a homeless person. Why are they privileged when it comes to personal responsibility?

    They aren’t. I’m firmly against anyone conspiring to assault anyone, which is what the woman in the original post was doing.

    I also know that laszlo isn’t Rachel Moran, and it would be tremendously unfair for me to blame her for what Rachel Moran says and does. Similarly, I know that the man begging outside the convenience store trying to buy bread for his children who thanked me profusely when I just went in and bought him a loaf is not the same as the man who came out of nowhere and screamed in laszlo’s ear. Which is why I don’t blame ‘the homeless’ for what someone, or a few people did.

    Why are they permitted to attack others, but no one is permitted to attack them except in extreme self-defense?

    They’re not permitted to attack others. Homeless people aren’t and shouldn’t be exempt from assault laws. If this were some woman blogging about how some homeless guy hit her for no reason, so she hit him back until he ran and called the cops, and not plotting to beat up agressive panhandlers more or less for fun, you’d get a very different response.

    And I don’t think anyone is, or should be permitted to attack anyone except in extreme self-defense.

    Why is this woman you are all discussing not accorded the same charity for her “mental condition” as you are according the random homeless? Where is the charity toward her?

    I don’t have that much charity for people who plot willful and malicious violence, and I have every reason to think that’s what the original blogger is doing. I do have charity for people who frighten strangers by mistake due to mental problems, and I have a great deal of sympathy for people who are being blamed for the actions of someone else who’s considered the same ‘type’ as them. I’m not trying to defend homeless people who are committing violent assault against strangers, the way Rachel Moran may be plotting to. I’m deeply concerned about the homeless person who may be targeted by someone trying to get revenge against the homeless for what one person did to them.

    You people are somewhat ridiculous. If you are not going to judge those on the street, you forfeit the right to judge on the web as well.

    I judge. You judge. Everyone judges. I judge someone cussing out a stranger on the street as generally less bad than beating up people for being rudely persistent. My judgement says that being homeless isn’t inherently blameworthy, and it’s fairer to judge a woman by her own words than to consider a homeless person automatically guilty of the offenses of any homeless people anywhere. If that makes me ridiculous in your eyes, so be it.

  52. Why is it that some people are allowed to give up that struggle and expect others to carry them, while the rest go on trying to do their best with what life hands them?

    No one’s “allowed” or “forbidden” to give up. Some people just get stuck, temporarily or permanently. They pull themselves out, get pulled out by others, or sink and die. Everyone can quit and hope someone else will carry them along, but almost no one will do this deliberately because of the risks of being left without help.

    Why are people considered unempathetic if they find their own burdens sufficient and do not wish to (or cannot) take on the additional burdens of those who have given up in one way or another? We won’t demand that a person carry his own burden, but we turn around and demand that others carry the burdens of two, themselves and random strangers who approach them on the street.

    It’s not about failing to help the homeless, or about not wanting to hand out money. If someone can’t or won’t go on, you don’t have to carry their burden, or them the whole way. But it’s common decency not to trample them as you pass, and the least we could expect not to stomp on their fallen bodies, screaming a them for blocking the path.

    You can chastise laszlo but heaven forbid anyone should chastise a homeless person. Why are they privileged when it comes to personal responsibility?

    They aren’t. I’m firmly against anyone conspiring to assault anyone, which is what the woman in the original post was doing.

    I also know that laszlo isn’t Rachel Moran, and it would be tremendously unfair for me to blame her for what Rachel Moran says and does. Similarly, I know that the man begging outside the convenience store trying to buy bread for his children who thanked me profusely when I just went in and bought him a loaf is not the same as the man who came out of nowhere and screamed in laszlo’s ear. Which is why I don’t blame ‘the homeless’ for what someone, or a few people did.

    Why are they permitted to attack others, but no one is permitted to attack them except in extreme self-defense?

    They’re not permitted to attack others. Homeless people aren’t and shouldn’t be exempt from assault laws. If this were some woman blogging about how some homeless guy hit her for no reason, so she hit him back until he ran and called the cops, and not plotting to beat up agressive panhandlers more or less for fun, you’d get a very different response.

    And I don’t think anyone is, or should be permitted to attack anyone except in extreme self-defense.

    Why is this woman you are all discussing not accorded the same charity for her “mental condition” as you are according the random homeless? Where is the charity toward her?

    I don’t have that much charity for people who plot willful and malicious violence, and I have every reason to think that’s what the original blogger is doing. I do have charity for people who frighten strangers by mistake due to mental problems, and I have a great deal of sympathy for people who are being blamed for the actions of someone else who’s considered the same ‘type’ as them. I’m not trying to defend homeless people who are committing violent assault against strangers, the way Rachel Moran may be plotting to. I’m deeply concerned about the homeless person who may be targeted by someone trying to get revenge against the homeless for what one person did to them.

    You people are somewhat ridiculous. If you are not going to judge those on the street, you forfeit the right to judge on the web as well.

    I judge. You judge. Everyone judges. I judge someone cussing out a stranger on the street as generally less bad than beating up people for being rudely persistent. My judgement says that being homeless isn’t inherently blameworthy, and it’s fairer to judge a woman by her own words than to consider a homeless person automatically guilty of the offenses of any homeless people anywhere. If that makes me ridiculous in your eyes, so be it.

  53. Carlos, if you actually think that people with serious mental illnesses have given up any kind of “struggle”, you have a profound misunderstanding of what a mental illness is like. Do you assume that people with leukemia have given up a struggle or have some kind of moral failing? Do you judge them for having leukemia?

    As for the blogger, what indication is there that she has a mental illness? I have empathy for people with actual mental illnesses, because without treatment, they often cannot help being irrational. I have no empathy for someone who can and is just an asshat. No choice vs. choice. Although I’m probably talking to a brick wall here, as you cannot seem to grasp the basic concept that people with untreated mental illnesses and no support system aren’t in a position to make the choices the blogger in question is.

  54. Carlos: We won’t demand that a person carry his own burden, but we turn around and demand that others carry the burdens of two, themselves and random strangers who approach them on the street… Why are they permitted to attack others, but no one is permitted to attack them except in extreme self-defense?

    No one in this thread has demanded the faux tough guys and chicks described in Ms. Moran’s repulsive blog post must hand cash over to bums on demand. Jesus the Nazarene does, cf. Matthew 5:42 or Mark 10:21 et seq., but this is not an Evangelical website so you won’t see any such demands made here. Much less has anyone claimed that homeless people should be exempt from the legal prohibition against “attacking others.” You just pulled those ideas out of thin air. Let the air reply to your complaints then; we have nothing to say to them.

    However, if by “carry the burdens of two” you mean “restrain yourself from deliberately provoking a fist fight with malice aforethought, intending to administer a beat-down to a complete stranger because you detest everyone in the socio-economic class he’s in, and filming the scene in order to inspire fear in the others,” yes, I do demand precisely that. I demand that you not prepare and carry out criminal attacks against any of the citizens of St. Petersburg, from the ragged homeless in the alleys all the way up to the elite residents of the multi-million dollar waterfront estates. Not only that, but if you can’t restrain yourself from criminal conspiracy to deliberately commit assault and battery on random strangers, I also demand that your worthless thug ass should be thrown in jail, and that the authorities throw away the key.

  55. Rachel Moran defends her post at Progressive Gold.

    I am astonished at how many people think that BAR TALK means my boyfriend is gonna film my sister’s boyfriend beating people up.

    And contrary to your rambling opening, I’m not taking the post down. It’s on my MySpace page, it’s on my own blog and it’s at Sticks of Fire. I stand by everything in it, because I expect there are people in the universe who are not so literal as to think I am actually beating up homeless people.

    The real point – agressive homeless people require aggressive action.

    She sounds like Dirty Harry. I’m also “astonished” that she would think she would film an assault on a homeless person after she wrote that she would.

  56. You know the fun part? A lot of employers do an internet search for prospective employees. And she’s got that post up with a name and a picture, so she can’t pull a “I’m a different Rachel Moran from St. Petersburg. Not the one who thinks assaulting homeless people is funny.”

    Reap what you’ve sown, Rachel. Hope you enjoy it.

  57. The entire discussion in comments was about aggressive panhandlers who intimidate people attempting to walk down the street unmolested into giving them money. Laszlo talks about people screaming, using profanity. For you, assault seems to be limited to hitting, but making people fearful is also assault. I have a friend who was followed home by a homeless person who told him his handout was not enough and he had to give more. I have been cursed out by homeless people for stepping over their outstretched legs as they blocked the sidewalk. Where else am I supposed to walk? I have been assaulted and cursed out (with no provocation whatsoever) by a homeless person on a bus to the point that I left the bus because I was afraid he would escalate to physical violence. This is what Laszlo was describing. These are the people you are urging empathy toward.

    Rachel is indulging a fantasy that you have taken very seriously. It arises from the intimidation dealt out by the homeless to those who will not contribute. Homeless people in Berkeley deliberately block the turnstyles and won’t let people pass without a handout. They coerce $20 bills from 18-20 yo students by standing a foot away from them with hands outstretched as they visit the Telegraph Ave. ATM machines.

    People do not ask for mental illness any more than they ask for any other sort of misfortune, but when they refuse treatment, they are responsible for their symptoms. Most mentally ill do not behave as homeless people do, so it is not an inevitable consequence of disease or disaster. People choose the easy way out and it results in abdication of responsibility. No one forces a person to become addicted to an illegal street drug. There is an initial choice to evade reality and seek pleasure, and an ongoing choice to avoid rehab. And yes, it is much easier to live on the street or a delusional state than it is to stay clean, be productive and face reality every day.

    Environmental determinism fails as a philosophy. If you apply it to the homeless, you must apply it equally to Rachel and wonder what awful experiences and faulty upbringing led her to her current sorry state. She is no more responsible for her blathering than the poor guy in the subway is for his curses. Be consistent or you are being hypocritical, in my opinion.

  58. this “hate and hurt the homeless because they upset my sense of aesthetic and make me feel uncomfortable” is a predominant view of the character in the book American Psycho by bret easton ellis. those planning to go out and beat up homeless people ought to read it. they would probably really enjoy the catharsis of not restraining their inner urges.

  59. People do not ask for mental illness any more than they ask for any other sort of misfortune, but when they refuse treatment, they are responsible for their symptoms. Most mentally ill do not behave as homeless people do, so it is not an inevitable consequence of disease or disaster. People choose the easy way out and it results in abdication of responsibility. No one forces a person to become addicted to an illegal street drug. There is an initial choice to evade reality and seek pleasure, and an ongoing choice to avoid rehab. And yes, it is much easier to live on the street or a delusional state than it is to stay clean, be productive and face reality every day.

    Fuck you very much, sweetheart. Not everybody with a mental illness has a big red M on their chest. I’ve suffered from clinical depression most of my life. Most stressed-out physically healthy 3-year old my pediatrician had ever seen (apparently he didn’t realise 3-year olds COULD be stressed out), suicidal thoughts and a bout of anorexia starting at 11, quite a few suicide attempts between ages 14 and 18.

    I’m 30 years old. I work, I own a home, I pay taxes, I do volunteer work, I adopted a hard case from the local animal shelter, I sing in a community choir, I attend a downtown church which runs a sandwich project and other outreach programs for the homeless. In short, I am a productive member of society. I would NOT be a productive member of society if it weren’t for the medications I take daily. And getting the right dosage is difficult enough with clinical depression (also, no med mix will continue to work forever, which means adjustment every few years).

    Most mental illnesses are even trickier to manage with medication, and the meds which allow people to function have worse side-effects. Not to mention the fact t hat many mentally ill people self-medicate with drugs and/or alcohol. Not because they’re weak or self-indulgent, but because they haven’t been correctly diagnosed. I come from a long line of alcoholics on one side of the family. I’m probably genetically predisposed towards alcoholism just like I’m probably genetically predisposed towards depression. Maybe one of the reasons I didn’t fall into alcoholism or drug use is because I’m lucky enough to be white, middle-class, Canadian (public health care), and have a mother who was savvy enough about the way the system works that she got me into therapy starting at the age of 11. Who knows.

    The point is, there but for the grace of God go I. I had to live at home well into my early twenties because I couldn’t function on my own. I sure as hell couldn’t have been relied upon to find a place to live or keep track of my medication. And I would’ve been a hell of a lot worse off if I’d gone off my meds and not had a safe place to live with a parent who put up with me. Do you know how long the waiting list is for supported living units for mentally ill people who can’t hold down a job and don’t have family that can keep them? Do you know how difficult it is to simultaneously treat addiction and mental illness? I don’t know how much money the province has put into meds and therapy for me over the years, but I imagine it’s significantly less than the money it would take to keep me in jail or a mental hospital. Not to mention the fact that for some years now I’ve been paying taxes into the system.

    And yes, I live in an East Side Vancouver neighbourhood which has panhandlers and such. I’ve never been harassed by one here, although I have been downtown. And no, I don’t give money to panhandlers. I get spare-changed all the time. I do, however, sometimes give out the $1 gift certificates to fast food restaurants that you can buy, because I figure at least that way if they’re addicted, I know the money’s going for food and not drugs or alcohol. In the event that a homeless person were to harass me or someone else on the street, I’d get out my cell phone and call 911. Of course, I’d do that if someone who wasn’t obviously homeless were harassing me or someone else, too.

    Nobody here is suggesting that it’s okay for the homeless to assault people. Some of us are pointing out the options which may help those people not get to that point in the first place, but we’re not condoning violence. We’re merely pointing out that the majority of homeless people are harmless to the general public, and shouldn’t be lumped in iwth the violent minority.

  60. Shorter Carlos: I’ve got mine, Jack. But don’t worry, if I get in trouble, I’ll expect you to help out because I’m morally better than those homeless leeches.

  61. Carlos, if you actually think that people with serious mental illnesses have given up any kind of “struggle”, you have a profound misunderstanding of what a mental illness is like.

    He also has a profound misunderstanding of what living on the streets is like. That sounds like a fun, easy life to you? It sounds like a horrific never ending struggle that we’re incredibly lucky we don’t have to experience to me.

    I think I’d rather worry about job stress in a nice comfortable home than worry about whether I’m more likely to be stabbed to death by a homeless hating psychopath on a heating grate or freeze to death hiding under a bridge and things like that.

  62. Refuse treatment ? For most of the group we’re discussing, ‘refusing treatment’ would assume they had comprehensive medical and psychological care available to them. In summary: they don’t. Millions of people in this country don’t.

    My schizophrenic aunt, at her lowest point, was roaming the streets and fighting with strangers and cops. She was pulled back from the brink by her family who loved her, and now she’s healthy and happy, watching her grandkids grow up. She’ll always struggle. But she’s the kind of person this article could be about- a crazy, seemingly dangerous nobody. Guess what ? She’s not a nobody. She’s a loving mother and grandmother and sister and aunt and daughter. Those homeless people are all someone’s family- many of them have family that struggle to stay in contact with them, or find them, or help them in any way they can.

    I understand the urge to protect yourself- I sometimes work security at my job, and I do keep out any homeless person who seems threatening. But it’s just my job to keep out any person who seems threatening. No distinction. If you’re dangerous, or an asshole, you’re going to be a dangerous asshole whether you’re wearing a five-dollar coat or a five-hundred dollar one. I don’t understand what happened, when being poor and homeless became something we were supposed to shame people for instead of trying to help them. WTF ?

    Some people in SUVs try to run me over because they assume they’re more important than me, and some homeless guys bless me when I sneeze and hold the door for me at McDonald’s. Yeah, some of them are crazy. But I know which side my sympathy’s on.

  63. Carlos, are you the reincarnation of Milton Friedman?

    You’ve certainly opened my eyes. I always did have more sympathy for desperate people who lead miserable lives of homelessness, lack of food, constant danger, and widespread societal derision. I never realized that my sympathies were misplaced and should have been reserved for the overprivileged, whiny assholes who fantasize about beating and killing the subhumans, and take great joy in making someone’s already miserable life that much worse. My apologies.

    You did forget to mention, however, that while we’re being oppressed by having to walk past a homeless person as well as by having hot water, indoor plumbing, soap, steady incomes, opportunities, food, and living quarters, these Lucky Duckies are also weaseling out of taxes. If some clueless sap gives a homeless person a buck, does he give thirty-three cents of that to the government, hell no! He does not. And that means I have to pay that much more for WMD thanks to this cheat, which realy burns me. It’s all part of the ideal lifestyle of Easy Street. The only thing that prevents me from giving up my home and family and super stressful hygeine routine and signing on for this blissful carefree idyllic lifestyle without a responsibility in sight is that I have too much strength, character, and too many morals. Go me.

    I realize my experience isn’t the Universal, but I don’t know too many Haight flower children or Less Than Zero yuppies who want to drop out and tune out the stresses of overprivilege through hedonism. Most of the addicts I’ve ever seen have experienced extreme physical, psychological, and/or sexual trauma. They may start out trying to numb their pain, but soon they’re just trying to stave off withdrawls that will make their lives even worse than they already are. But then again, they do reject all that readily available free detox and rehab, as you point out. Why, it’s just there for the asking. It’s weak. I’m glad I’m not like that.

    Which isn’t to say that no treatment is available for the homeless. My friend’s girlfriend wants to be a surgeon. She’s so incompetent that they’d never allow her to practice on actual humans, but since Daddy has more money than god and is good for a wing or two, she gets to perform surgey on the homeless. Oh, she’s killed more than you can count since she can’t handle even the most routine procedure, but well, there’s a reason she gets these particular patients. They don’t tend to have a whole lot of known relatives to complain or file malpractice suits.

  64. In our town, a few years ago, one of our well-known homeless people was murdered (by some other homeless guys who thought he had some money) and a sizeable portion of the town went to his funeral. Long ago, a columnist ran a contest to finish the sentence “Corvallis is the kind of town where . . .” Well, it’s the kind of town where people go to homeless people’s funerals, and I’m proud of it.

  65. On giving the money to the poor folks: I remember there was an experiment with this way back when I was very young. Some city had a windfall and debated whether to hire more welfare caseworkers, or just divvy the money up and give it to the poor folks. They decided to give it to the poor folks, who used it to get their teeth fixed, buy cars, get better clothes, go out and get jobs, etc. It was a fabulous success, so of course it was never tried again.

  66. It was a fabulous success, so of course it was never tried again.

    Ahh, that made me laugh. And then cry a little. That’s the way it seems to be.

  67. I didn’t talk about aesthetics or “walking by” homeless. I talked about being assaulted by them. You all read right past that. Why? Because it is OK for them to assault others? Because people don’t matter if they aren’t downtrodden?

    I didn’t say it was easy dealing with mental illness, but it is certainly easier living on the street and “self-medicating” than it is trying to cope with it more actively. It IS giving up. It is taking what comes instead of trying to improve one’s situation. I do know what mental illness is like and I do know what addiction is like. I also know that those who avoid addiction and those who stick with medication even when it has side effects and seems to be doing little good, are more likely to succeed than those who prefer their symptoms. And yes, I know that there are other options because there are many efforts to help people get off the streets — the more time one spends there, the more likely they will have come into contact with them.

    You do not wish to hold anyone responsible for their own reaction to their circumstances. No one has chosen to think about the philosophical issue — but plenty of you feel comfortable calling me all sorts of names without knowing anything about me. Especially, assuming that I am privileged and not mentally ill or addicted, never homeless, etc.

    I’m not sure where this knee-jerk anger at the suggestion of misplaced empathy comes from. I would never hurt a homeless person, but they seem plenty willing to hurt me. Are they exempt from human reciprocities? Aren’t you treating them like subhuman beings, children perhaps, when you excuse them from the same behavioral courtesies and rules that we all observe? If you place them in a category where they are incapable of (1) interacting with others in equality, (2) solving any of their own problems, aren’t you robbing them of what makes us human? Pity is corrosive and you have to place someone subordinate to yourself in order to indulge in it. People used to have too much pride to accept such subordination. Now they accept the handout but show contempt toward those who give — in order to maintain their dignity. Some of the cursing and aggressive behavior reflects this struggle. You are the ones who do them damage by infantilizing them, and you think you are wonderful for doing it. Please look at the ugly side of your empathy.

  68. Environmental determinism fails as a philosophy.

    Now I get it; you’re having the Imaginary Debate. You’ve decided that everyone must either blame The Homeless for the behavior of The Homeless (since they’re all secretly a hive colony controlled by the Homeless Ubermind), or be philisophically devoted to absolute Environmental Determinism. And having found a nest of fantatical Environmental Deteriminsts, you’ve decided to defeat our faulty logic.

    I’ll give you some free advice;

    -First, we’re not all controlled by the Liberal Ubermind.

    -Second, The Homeless aren’t all controlled by the Homeless Ubermind, but are a number of completely seperate people, who have a number of different life circumstances, and behave in different ways. So it’s possible to hope that the next guy who approaches Rachel Moran and her friends for a quarter doesn’t get beaten bloody without excusing some guy in Vancouver who harassed poor lazlo.

    -Third, while there are people who think that everyone is completly and absolutely morally responsible for every life circumstance, and there are people who believe that no one’s at all to blame for anything, there’s people who don’t actually believe either position. I (not to be mistaken for everyone on the blog, or everyone who knows how to type), am of the view that people generally have a lot of responsibility for decisions they make while mentally healthy, less for decisions they make while suffering mental illness, and none for life circumstances that happen to them beyond their control. And while this is the tricky part, life circumstances can restrict how much they get to decide. Which means that a schizophrenic whose family has money, insurance that covers psychiatric care, and is willing to support them, and gets properly stabilized probably has more responsibility for screaming at strangers on the street than someone who has no shot at seeing a psychiatrist or getting correctly diagnosed, but probably less than a mentally healthy person who does it for fun.

    Oh, and internet lawyer? Assault requires that they knowingly make you fearful of imminent harm. So you can’t charge them with assault for looking creepy in front of you, or if they stand with their hands out and you have a paranoid fantasy of them jumping out and mugging you.

  69. I just found out I’m on Rachel Moran’s blogroll. Is she grateful for this negative attention I helped heep her way. I’m encouraging people to call the police on her and she puts me on her blogroll. WTF?

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