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Weekly Open Thread with Robogals

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For this week’s Open Thread I’m highlighting the non-profit international student organisation Robogals (looking for more chapters in more countries!), whose mission is to encourage greater numbers of women to study Engineering, Science and Technology. Please natter/chatter/vent/rant on anything* you like over this weekend and throughout the week.

A group of young women and girls with a robot
Robogals volunteers and attendees at Science Challenge 2013

Post by Robogals.

So, what have you been up to? What would you rather be up to? What’s been awesome/awful? Reading? Watching? Making? Meeting? What has [insert awesome inspiration/fave fansquee/guilty pleasure/dastardly ne’er-do-well/threat to all civilised life on the planet du jour] been up to?

* Netiquette footnotes: * There is no off-topic on the Weekly Open Thread, but consider whether your comment would be on-topic on any recent thread and thus better belongs there. * If your comment touches on topics known to generally result in thread-jacking, you will be expected to take the discussion to #spillover instead of overshadowing the social/circuit-breaking aspects of this thread.

63 thoughts on Weekly Open Thread with Robogals

  1. Question! Does anyone else thing “kerfuffle” sounds diminutive? I had to google the definition to ensure it was being used correctly, but it did seem as if in the “Ani DiFranco kerfuffle,” the only people using that word were the apologists. I’m also pretty sure every time the internet gets mad at He Who Must Not Be Named, it’s always his defenders that use the term.

    Anyway, I’m coming down strongly anti-“kerfuffle.”

    1. Yup, the mere sight of the word irks me off at this point. I always expect dismissive apologia to follow.

    4. Agreed. I noticed that on the ani defranco thread, and it really struck me as trivializing the situation. I read it as “much ado about nothing,” in a condescending sort of way.

    5. “Kerfuffle” is something that happens with British cats, IMO. It’s meant to be a little dismissive or even joking. I feel you.

    6. Agreed! I only ever used to see “kerfuffle” in the context of fandom-related tiffs, where it is often a perfect way to describe the shenanigans. In the social justice context, it’s entirely inappropriate and dismissive.

  2. JESUS FUCK Adele Wilde-Blavatsky’s an asshole and a racist. It’s not just me, right? That twitter’s a clusterfuck, right?

    In other news: back to school Monday, woo! I actually feel happyish about this term. Of course, this term’s also the one I have a lit. theory class on feminism, race studies and queer theory in consecutive weeks, so I plan on having no school friends by the end of it. -_-

    1. But she’s a provocateur, Mac!

      Yeah, she’s all kinds of yuck, from my brief perusal of her Twitter. I generally un-Twitter, pretty much because I can’t stand the weird soapbox as shouting into the wind that seems to be its primary MO.

    4. Disagree.
      Wilde Blavatsky is a woman who’s seen more of English and Indian social dynamics than those in the USA.
      India’s caste system is something they’d already managed to do without the “help” of the East India Company or Mughal Rule. And England’s (fuck, everyone’s) still dealing with the repercussions of what happens when a few rich white men reckoned they’d earn even more from slave farmed cotton than tenant farmed wool. Having a choice of drinking yourself to death in factory town slums or being shot or arrested for staying on your old homelands…also happened to whites.

      Categorically stating that all the darker people are in it together and paler people just don’t “get it” is maddeningly factually inaccurate. Insisting the objections aren’t down to the inaccuracy but instead to upset, never before before challenged white supremacy is edging into Gaslighting.

      Then there’s the bit where a “Collective Response” of…70? woman piled on in to counter something she never said, never implied about Hijabs. The internet’s allowing conversations to be had across time-zones, geography and racist warpings of socioeconomic strata that simply should not be, but unless The Collective are coming in from a server in a parallel universe where men are frequently beaten by “police” for going hoodless and thus whorishly disrespecting their family and god….that does look an awful lot like bullying.

      So I can see why she’s unraveling there on Twitter.
      Adele Wilde-Blavatsky, I believe you. However, for the love of all that is good in the word, step away from the internet now please. You’ll feel better, we’ll all feel better. Cheers.

      1. Wilde Blavatsky is a woman who’s seen more of English and Indian social dynamics than those in the USA.

        I`m an Indian who’s spent all of one week in the US in my life, but thank you, thank you for Westsplaining to me! I really appreciated your and Wilde-Blkeysmash’s information about the caste system, which, as a lifelong Hindu, had been a complete mystery to me until your succinct summary as to its origins and history. Thank you also for telling me patent untruths about Indian culture, and tsking at my doubtless US-manufactured outrage! The invalidation helped me to see that truly, it is the Great White Shark Hope’s knowledge of India that was right all along and I, a mere Indian, could never really hope to stand up against an assertion by Wilde-Blavatsky (praise be her name) with my puny lifetime of experience and piddling statistics from the national census.

        I also really liked your kind reminder in particular, Funty, that white people also suffered from colonialism, which, as an Indian citizen who is completely unacquainted with the dynamics of imperialism, I had never heard before. Truly, Funty and Wilde-Blvkeysmash, you are a formidable treasure-house of important, scintillating new truths. I must know more truths! Please tell me more truths. I am your humble daasi.

        Categorically stating that all the darker people are in it together and paler people just don’t “get it” is maddeningly factually inaccurate.

        …so how white are you, by the way? White? Really white? Casper the friendly ghost?

        I don’t believe all the “darker people” (wat) are some wall of solidarity against the Evul Whitez, and I didn’t see anyone telling her that either. WB decided to have a huge fight with several Indians about India, made patently untrue statements about Indians and used her husband and child as a reason she couldn’t be racist (which makes every slaveowner who raped a black slave not a racist, right? And straight-married men can’t ever be misogynists?). So, you know.

        No.

        1. I saw funtys comment this morning and have been waiting eagerly for mac’s response. I was not disappointed. Glorious, mac. Simply glorious.

      2. I do have to hand it to you, though. I’ve never seen “but won’t someone think of the children poor people in England?” as a way to invalidate colonised people before. That’s some innovative shit right there. You should, like, patent it and stuff.

        1. Beware the wroth of the dotdots and woowoos! We actually know what colonization is! Turns out, we’re not so dumb after all.

        3. I won’t say there was cackling happening while it was typed….but I won’t say there wasn’t either. 😉

      3. No, oh my goodness, no. Everything mac said.

        Also, as an English person of Indian origin, white English people who are SOSPIRITUUL, SO UNDERSTANDINGZ, MUCH WHITE SAVIOURING, of my country of origin at me after spending about 0.01% of the time there that I have are pretty much the worst.

        Also, also, did you just compare being a slave and/or colonised to being working class in the UK? That’s not just wrong, it plays into the way white supremacist political parties currently operate in the UK, preying on working class people to try and get them to hate and fear non-white immigrants (or their descendants) for “having it better” than they do. How about not reinforcing that particular fun dynamic?

        And finally, who’s being gaslit here? The WOC with no mainstream media platform calling out the racism, or the WW who routinely get to cry “bullies!” with no empirical evidence in all of the main UK newspapers and news websites. Just stop already.

    5. Ok, stupid irrelevant question: Wilde-Blavatsky? Is that her real name? It’s a shame she’s such a shithead, because that is an awesome surname.

  3. As of this week, I am waiting on a big fat check from EI for the six weeks I was off work after my surgery. Thanks Jane for recommending the Service Canada complaint line.

      1. Apparently. I’m not sure what its functions is beyond calling someone else at Service Canada and saying “yo, can someone fucking deal with this please?” But it worked.

        Turns out someone lost my record of employment and that’s why my application was on hold. Not that I could figure that out from their crappy website OR crappy automated phone line.

  4. My aunt and cousins just left after visiting us over the holidays. I always enjoys seeing them, but this time I couldn’t shake a feeling of sadness. For various reasons I’m coming out as trans sometime this spring, and while I love them dearly my aunt and cousins are somewhat conservative about things like this. I’m afraid that this will have been the last time I see them, or at least the last time I see them while having as close a relationship with them as I do.

    1. I’m in a similar boat, SophiaBlue. I’m going to come out to the rest of my conservative family sometime this month, and I’m really scared. We had a mini family reunion a week ago, and I felt horrible because, even though all of my aunts and uncles were nice to me, they weren’t nice to the real me. And I doubt they’ll ever be because of their views – unless a miracle happens and my coming out encourages them to question their bigotry. It’s heartbreaking to think about, and I’m sorry to hear you’re going through something similar. Best of luck to you.

    2. I’m wishing you luck, Sophia, and hoping that whatever your family’s response, you will have supportive people around you.

    3. This really hit a nerve with me, because I’m in exactly the same position re: a lot of friends from conservative families, right now. I’m sorry. I know it’s awful. I’m sorry.

  5. Some advice would be appreciated: Would it be okay to come out publicly on Facebook? Or would it be wiser to just stick to emailing family members about me being trans? I’m tempted to talk about it on Facebook because I know more people through Facebook than through email (I don’t have everyone’s email address) but I’m worried about causing too much commotion.

    1. Wow, Ally, does this mean you’ve gotten away? I hope so; I want you to be safe and happy.

      If you are safe, then I think that a personal email is more…personal, more intimate, more treating the news with the respect something so important as revealing your true self deserves. But ultimately, what matters is not commotion, and not intimacy, and not what I or anybody else here think is better. What matters most is what you will find most fulfilling while keeping yourself as safe as possible, both physically and emotionally, and my real advice is to prioritize that.

        1. Facebook offers better opportunities for controlling the “spin” others put on it.

          Thanks for pointing that out. I really don’t want people spreading around shit like “[male name] IS CRAZY STAY AWAY FROM HIM [sic]” without it being questioned/criticized.

        2. Yes, you definitely don’t need that!

          I would probably suggest a two-pronged solution, sort of, where you make the initial post on Facebook and then immediately (like within 10 minutes, immediately) email your close family/friends with an abbreviated version of that and attaching a “you mean a lot to me which is why you are receiving this extra email, as a way to keep in touch with me privately if you would rather do that”. It leaves the door open for potential allies, especially minor-aged ones or people with angry/controlling spouses, to be more civil than family/social dynamics might allow them to be, publicly.

    2. Do you have people on Facebook who you know will support you and push back against any hate you receive? If so, I would be inclined to go that direction.

      1. The good thing about coming out on Facebook, aside from the benefit of coming out to more people that way, is that nearly half of my Facebook friends are supportive of trans people. The other half is exactly the opposite. My Facebook friends are neatly split into two groups.

        Seeing all of the support would mean a lot to me – and I’m very curious about people I haven’t talked to in ages coming out to support me – but I hope that none of my supportive friends gets into a heated argument with one of my family members. Like, I can see the arguments between my Facebook friends easily descending into “Fuck you, asshole, you’re a disgusting human being” which isn’t something I categorically condemn, but it will surely cause even more tension.

        But at least on Facebook, I won’t be alone – unlike in some email thread in which only my family members are allowed. So far I know only 5 people in the family who support me. So I’m starting to lean towards Facebook.

        1. Ally, you might like to use the feature of FB where it allows you to sort your FB Friends according to groupings, and then you can control whether only some of those groups see certain updates. That way you could have some announcement posts about coming out be visible to all your FB friends, but also some venting-type posts be visible only to your trans-supportive friends, and some only to your supportive family members, etc. You can also set the default for your posts to be that only the trans-supportive group sees them unless you make a deliberate choice to share them with a larger group of friends/family.

    3. To clarify: I haven’t left yet. I know I need to leave, but I’m very afraid of leaving at the “wrong” time and I keep thinking about how I’m going to cause pain for everyone I know. Almost no one offline supports me. And while my mom and my siblings have assured me that they won’t see my escape as some kind of betrayal, they certainly won’t expect it and I’m sure all of them are going to be worried sick. My thought process is basically like this:

      “I need to leave or else I’ll be in danger when I come out.”

      “But if I leave, then my dad won’t be able to concentrate at work, my brother will be stressed out and crying, my sister will panic because she thinks my friend is untrustworthy, and the rest of the family will be in crisis mode.”

      I just can’t help but keep worrying about how my escape will be burdensome for everyone. On top of all of this I’m worried about making things too difficult for my friend. She is patient and very sweet, but I’m afraid of being burdensome in case I start having severe anxiety attacks (and the vomiting that often accompanies my anxiety attacks). I don’t want her to feel like I’m a kid she has to take care of, if you know what I mean.

      I wish I could to do something to feel less anxious about all of this. I’ve never been this afraid of a personal decision, even though I know it’s for my own good. If I don’t reduce my anxiety soon, I might cancel my plans.

      1. I just can’t help but keep worrying about how my escape will be burdensome for everyone. On top of all of this I’m worried about making things too difficult for my friend. She is patient and very sweet, but I’m afraid of being burdensome in case I start having severe anxiety attacks (and the vomiting that often accompanies my anxiety attacks). I don’t want her to feel like I’m a kid she has to take care of, if you know what I mean.

        Ally, I’ve done a lot of care over the years for sick/drunk/anxious friends (and I mean full scale anxiety attacks with vomiting and shaking and lying on the pavement for an hour), and I’ve been the recipient of that kind of care. It’s completely ok to be burdensome sometimes. That’s what friends are for: to support you when you can’t support yourself. One day you’ll be able to reciprocate. I’m sure your friend understands that.

        And I can’t speak to your particular physiological experiences of anxiety, but I think really the only thing that is in the long term going to make you less anxious about leaving is to just do it, because otherwise you’ll really just end up in a miserable cycle. It’s scary, but I think you’re capable of doing it and getting through it.

        1. Ally, seconding Li in everything, especially this:

          And I can’t speak to your particular physiological experiences of anxiety, but I think really the only thing that is in the long term going to make you less anxious about leaving is to just do it, because otherwise you’ll really just end up in a miserable cycle.

        2. I’ve done a lot of care over the years for sick/drunk/anxious friends (and I mean full scale anxiety attacks with vomiting and shaking and lying on the pavement for an hour), and I’ve been the recipient of that kind of care. It’s completely ok to be burdensome sometimes. That’s what friends are for: to support you when you can’t support yourself. One day you’ll be able to reciprocate.

          I want to second this. That’s what people who care about you are for. That’s what we’re all for for the people we care about. And it’s something every single person will need at some point.

      2. Ally, on those lines, there’ll never be a right time for you to leave. Your father’s an abusive controller; let him be distracted at work. He’s distracted you from your whole life! Fuck him. I know you want him to love you but he’s simply not going to, he’s an abuser and you’re never going to change him. Trying to be thoughtful and caring to him has got you nothing but more abuse. You aren’t responsible for his emotional welfare and trying to take it into account is only causing you more pain and making your escape more difficult.

        As to your mother and siblings – they know you have to leave, and their worries are their own problems, not yours. You’ve warned them you’re going, they know who you’re going to, and their own opinions are just that – opinions. They don’t know your friend, you do. You’re an adult, you aren’t obliged to check in with them for your life. It’s not like you’re severing contact forever! You’re getting out and finding a safe place, and they really need to shut up and let you get on with it, and support you, not carp and fret because they may have to talk to the parental unit again. Your brother already has his own plans to get away; he was going to do it earlier, wasn’t he, and then didn’t, and that made things more difficult for you. Did he take you into account when he changed his plans? No, he did what worked for him, for whatever reason and however he felt about it and you.

        Fear and jerkbrain are never going to let up on this, Ally, not while you’re in that house. I know how pervasive and hard to fight stress and anxiety are, and I’ve had an infinitesimal amount to deal with compared with you. All I can say is, keep fighting, you’re stronger than the fear wants you to realise, and try, try not to let it make the decisions.

        Lotsa hugs from me

      3. Ally, I sympathize with what you’re saying. My situation isn’t as bad a yours, but I do worry about how much I’m going to be hurting my mom and my dad and my brother. Sometimes I wish I could bottle everything up for their sake, be who they want me to be.

        So I understand where your coming from. But you’re important too, Ally. Your feelings, your mental health are just as important as their’s. It will probably hurt them when you leave, but you cannot break yourself apart for anyone, not even the people you love. I agree with Li above that the only way to not be anxious about this is to take a deep breath and just do it.

        1. Ally and Sophia, I think it’s important to know intellectually even if you can’t process it in your heart yet that you won’t be hurting your family; they will be allowing their own transphobia to hurt them.

          A friend of mine just told me a story. Forty years ago, he came out as gay to his father–this would’ve been in the mid-1970s. I know that for many people being gay is easier to accept than being trans, but he was terrified about it. His parents didn’t say much that night, but the next morning they drove him back to the train station to go back to school just like normal. Two days later, he got letters from them. The one from his father read something like (I’m not going to get the exact words here) “I can’t say I understand all of your experiences or how you feel, but you are still my beloved son. I love you now just as I will love you always. Nothing changes that.”

          You both deserve that kind of response to coming out (substitute “child” for “son,” of course). If you don’t get that, it’s not because you’ve done anything to hurt your family. It’s because they have failed you.

          One more story. Let me start by saying that I’m not using this analogy to equate being trans to having a mental illness, but as an example of a major life decision that is frightening but necessary. Here it is: I have been depressive ever since puberty, mildly depressed when normal and deeply, deeply depressed for months or even years at a time at some points. I didn’t go on anti-depressants until I was 25, and it changed my life. Sometimes, now, 12 years later, I still have pangs of regret for all the years I wasted being miserable; I wonder what I could have achieved if I hadn’t been spending the best part of my energy battling depression; I wonder what it would’ve been like to experience high school and college without depression; I mourn for the fact that people I loved, like my grandparents and late best friend never once knew me when I wasn’t at least mildly depressed. I am grateful for all the years I saved by going on them when I did, but I still regret the years I lost because I refused to consider taking meds.

          My psychiatrist once told me, in the course of discussing something else, that he was seeing a trans man who had begun coming to him before transitioning, and that nothing but nothing had helped this man’s depression and anxiety until he had become transitioning.

          Your lives matter. Don’t give up any more years than you have to. Each one is precious. Who knows what you could do if you weren’t suffering like this?

      4. I think sometimes it’s good to just let friends be friends. Friends help friends. Let your friend help.
        As for your family, well, what everybody else said above, I think, and also that you are not obligated to suffer more so that they suffer less.

  6. Several of my friends shared this video on Facebook which I thought sounded like a bunch of racist nonsense, but all are POC as is the man in the video, and all had basically positive things to say about it. I’d be interested in the views of the people here (the friends I’ve mentioned who shared it aren’t particularly social justice or politically oriented…)

    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=221534748011905

    1. An evangelical pastor at the head of a megachurch lecturing black people to produce rather than consume seems rather hypocritical. This doesn’t address the truth of his statements though. Is it true that self-satisfaction is more easily gained from producing something than consuming something? I would agree with that. But what format is this message in? A video to be watched and then shared. Is the viewer supposed to watch it and say “Yup! That’s me! I don’t work, I just buy. Better get off facebook and start working!” No. They’re supposed to think “He’s right, I work, but those other people aren’t and they’re creating my problems. By golly I better pay attention to this guy.” The viewer knows he’s not talking about them in the same way they know he’s not talking about himself when he says “We are not producing”.

      The pastor produced the speech and video for it to facilitate consumption. He gets to feel proud of that work. People are supposed to watch it, share it, and feel satisfied for a moment (the fleeting satisfaction of consumption) and then go back to him for more.

      What I don’t understand is the implication that African Americans don’t work, just consume. That sounds pretty false. Maybe I’m misunderstanding and the implication is that African Americans don’t value production as much as consumption? How’s creating a video for African American consumption supposed to encourage changing those values? It’s not. It’s supposed to convince them their problem comes from other people not working.

      The last thing he says is “We are trapped by our own understanding of ourselves” and I might agree with that, but it goes against the things he did and said previous to that which purport to help African Americans understand their own depression.

      He’s the head of a megachurch. If African Americans did what he said and stopped consuming his explanations to help them understand themselves then he’d be out of a job because they’d be too busy producing to listen to his speeches and give him money.

      One thing is for sure. Racism certainly was not caused by black people not producing enough and that’s not what keeps it going either.

    2. Well, if we’re going to talk about producing, we’re going to have to talk about the means of production, capital, and who’s in control of them, I think.

  7. We’re in the midst of the deep freeze and the kids’ school has been cancelled today AND tomorrow. I am all out of ideas as to how to keep them busy in a constructive and/or entertaining way. And now sending them outside to play in the snow is out, because -20F, in direct sunlight!

    Hope everyone else is staying warm.

    1. We’re getting a similar deep freeze (not quite as cold.. -20C as opposed to F) but the snow keeps coming.. and coming.. I don’t have room to put it all. The other day the boyfriend, while shovelling, was able to sit down for a rest.. on the top of the neighbours’ 8 foot fence.

      1. Aaand we’re into a full on blizzard warning. Wind chills up to -45c and up to 40 (more) cm of snow. Locals are being advised to stay indoors at all costs.

        Fuck this country.

        1. If it makes you feel any better, it’s almost warm here… which, of course, means we’re facing flood warnings instead.

  8. I am sick. My jerkface husband gave me his cold. When I’m feeling better , I must think of ways to make him pay.

  9. Holy eff, this.

    A 14-year-old boy is being hailed as a hero in Pakistan for tackling a suicide bomber — dying at the main gate of his school and saving schoolmates gathered for their morning assembly.

    Do you ever wonder if you could be that brave in the same situation? I would say he’s a hero for sure.

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