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Having an openly fat relationship

I’m on the couch with my husband, our roommate sitting on the other couch, drinking beer and talking about whatever. The conversation drifts to women and body image and our roommate laments the “worst question” that women can ask their boyfriends: Do I look fat in this? You’re screwed either way, he complains. My husband laughs and says he’s so happy he doesn’t have to deal with that.

I give him an intentionally-pathetic expression and ask, “Honey, do I look fat in this?”

He laughs and says, “Yep!” then grabs my ass for good measure. I smack his hand away in faux horror. We almost fall off the couch, laughing at our roommate’s shocked expression. He thinks that my husband will be sleeping on that couch tonight, for sure. But there was no such thing.

My husband and I have an openly fat relationship.

My fattness is not this bizarre unspoken-about characteristic that will cause instant strife when mentioned. My husband is not obligated to pretend that I’m not fat. And, if he did, it would annoy the crap out of me. So we have an openly fat relationship.

What do I mean by that? I mean that I acknowledge that I’m a fat woman. And not a fat woman with thin woman inside waiting to break free.* I am fat and will probably always be fat. And Mr. Shoshie doesn’t sit around, hoping that some day I’ll lose weight. He acknowledges my fat, as part of my sexy awesome self. Most of the time it’s meaningless. Sometimes it’s important, like when I’m on top during sex, or when we’re carpooling (I almost always sit in front if there’s people squishing into the back).

As I took the first cautious steps into the fat acceptance pool (Come in! The water’s great!) it became more and more important for me to be openly fat. The assumption in the US, is if you’re fat, you are not OK with your body. Which is somewhat understandable, given that even so-called body acceptance advocates often decide to become spokespeople for weight loss and start doing a lot of speaking about how awesome it’ll be when they lose weight because fat people are gross and unhappy and unhealthy, amirite? (I’ll admit that it kills a small piece of me whenever this happens, though I’ve mostly gotten used to it). So I started using fat as a self-descriptor. I started arguing with people who protest when I use it as a self-descriptor. I’m still wrestling with how I refer to other fat individuals, since most people won’t use fat as a self-descriptor. I’m honest about where I purchase my clothing. I’ve even spoken about my specific weight a couple of times (this is what 250 or so lbs looks like on a 5’2″-ish person).

And so, I’ve gradually come out of the fat closet. I mean, to a certain extent, fat people are forced into the open. There’s not really possible to hide that you’re fat, at least IRL. Except there still are things. People don’t know how fat you have to be to be forced out of straight-size stores. People don’t know how fat you have to be to have to buy all your clothes online, because not even Lane Bryant fits. People don’t know what morbidly obese looks like, and they throw around this term like it’s nothing. (Oh I don’t mean yoooooou. I mean those really fat people. You know, morbidly obese. *headdesk*) People don’t know what kinds of oppression fat people face.

So, if you’re fat, I encourage you to dip your toes in. Start talking about your experience as a fat person. Like so many axes of oppression (all of them?), marginalization is built around dehumanizing us. They chop off our heads so we can serve better as demons and scapegoats.

Well, fuck that. I’m a person. And I build openly fat relationships.

*OK, this metaphor has started seriously wigging me out. I mean, did I eat a thin woman? Because I’m a fat chick and fat chicks eat everything? Or has she been growing inside me like some alien spawn and suddenly she’s going to burst through my chest all sci-fi like and fat Shoshie will just be left there like some hollow skin shell thing? Urhgle. This is how my brain works.


70 thoughts on Having an openly fat relationship

  1. Great post! I like the idea of accepting yourself at any size.

    As someone whose weight has fluctuated (sometimes due to illness and/or medication, sometimes due to my own concerted efforts, or lack thereof) I’m starting to come to the conclusion that my current weight (in the area of 180 lbs – I’m 5’5″) may be where my body (not necessarily me) is most comfortable.

    I’m trying to reconcile my own self-confidence and and work away from the feeling of failure I’ve had at not reaching that ‘ideal’ weight range for my height – supposedly between the 130-150 range – as if that would be some magic button number. Focusing on maintaining the healthier habits I picked up during my weight loss efforts and on keeping active for the sake of *feeling good* have helped but I still have days where it’s really hard to accept where I am at now.

    But I’m working on it.

  2. TW for ED-related matter.

    I should add that sometimes I question my own self-identification, because I’m not sure if when I declare that I am fat in a matter-of-fact manner and people jump to decry that notion, if they are really just being polite (because like you touched on, people really have a hard time with others self-identifying as fat) or if maybe I do have a touch of a body dysmorphia. *shrug*

  3. Lovely post. 😀 I am trying to live an openly fat lifestyle and when I’m looking to start a new relationship I’ve learned to state up front that my #1 deal-breaker is body-negativity. I can’t be comfortable around or be attracted to someone who makes me feel bad about bodies – mine, theirs, or anyone’s. It’s my instant turn-off.

    *OK, this metaphor has started seriously wigging me out. I mean, did I eat a thin woman? Because I’m a fat chick and fat chicks eat everything? Or has she been growing inside me like some alien spawn and suddenly she’s going to burst through my chest all sci-fi like and fat Shoshie will just be left there like some hollow skin shell thing? Urhgle. This is how my brain works.

    I like to joke that I’m trying to get fat enough to split into two people so that my fat clone can do my thesis for me. Inspired, no doubt, by that one Doctor Who episode…

  4. Thank you so much for writing this! Body acceptance is difficult for all women but I have this idea that it’s impossible for “fat” women. Really, fat is just a word (just like thin is). You make them your own.

  5. “My fattness is not this bizarre unspoken-about characteristic that will cause instant strife when mentioned.”

    Yeah, apparently it is used by all and sundry to equal “ugly”, maybe they should all find another term to express that.

  6. Awesome post. I wish I could have seen the look on the roommate’s face.

    Do you feel that fat is a word that everyone should use to describe you? eg: “Have you met my friend shoshie?” “What does she look like?” “Kinda short, curly brown hair, fat” “Oh yeah she’s cool!”

    Do you feel that there are some words that you might use, that you wouldn’t feel comfortable other people using?

  7. In India, for a lot of the older people at least, fatter is better. The younger people are more influenced by the Western media but the ideal body size even for them is at least 4 sizes above the US.

    I had a American colleague who was in India for a couple of months on an assignment who visited a friend’s house a couple of times and the friend’s grandmom thought of complimenting her by saying you must be enjoying Indian food because she looked plumper.

    The American girl instantly reacted like someone had deeply insulted her or something. She maintained her composure at the house but the next day at work she was crying for a couple of hours. According to her calling someone fat in the US was equivalent to calling a black guy the n-word.

  8. An excellent post. Ms Shoshie, you remind me of Wendy Crump in “Rumpole and the Model Prisoner,” in which most of the characters tiptoe around the truth and inflate an insensitive remark that in the end doesn’t bother in the least the person to whom it referred. Do you know the story?

  9. DoublyLinkedLists: Awesome post. I wish I could have seen the look on the roommate’s face.

    Oh, it was SO priceless.

    DoublyLinkedLists: Do you feel that fat is a word that everyone should use to describe you? eg: “Have you met my friend shoshie?” “What does she look like?” “Kinda short, curly brown hair, fat” “Oh yeah she’s cool!”

    Do you feel that there are some words that you might use, that you wouldn’t feel comfortable other people using?

    At this point, I kind of feel about fat the way I feel about Jew or woman or queer. Like, those are all words that are descriptors that I apply to myself that can be neutral or even positive. They also have a history of being used very negatively, and often still are. So if someone knows that I identify as fat and respects that I’d rather be called fat than “fluffy” or some other bullshit euphemism, then I’m totally on-board with them using fat to describe me. Though, I’ll admit, it took time. Despite the campaigns, self-love and self-acceptance isn’t easy.

    My senior year in college, after I’d been doing the fat acceptance thing for about six months, someone approached me about participating in a project about beauty ideals. She was photographing women who had bodies that matched beauty icons throughout history, had heard me talk about fat acceptance for a term paper presentation, and wanted to match me with the Venus of Willendorf. My first reaction was to start internally screaming, “BUT I’M NOT THAT FAT!!!” Followed by, “Wait, yes I am. And holy shit, someone just compared your body to that of a fucking goddess! Why the fuck are you freaking out?!”

  10. DouglasG: An excellent post. Ms Shoshie, you remind me of Wendy Crump in “Rumpole and the Model Prisoner,” in which most of the characters tiptoe around the truth and inflate an insensitive remark that in the end doesn’t bother in the least the person to whom it referred. Do you know the story?

    That sounds like an awesome story! I’ll have to look it up. I’m totally in love with short stories. I think they’re my favorite medium of writing.

  11. Fat acceptance has been a struggle for me. Growing up believing that my body was disgusting, sometimes acceptance feels like caving to defeat. Most days, I am fine, but I still have to remind myself that FA means allowing myself to stop participating in a destructive and pointless cycle of violence against my body.

    There is a guy in my life who loves my body as much as the rest of me. Ever since meeting him, I am committed to only being with people who love and appreciate my body as much as my mind and spirit, and who don’t think of my body or size as a negative.

  12. Andie:
    TW for ED-related matter.

    I should add that sometimes I question my own self-identification, because I’m not sure if when I declare that I am fat in a matter-of-fact manner and people jump to decry that notion, if they are really just being polite (because like you touched on, people really have a hard time with others self-identifying as fat) or if maybe I do have a touch of a body dysmorphia.*shrug*

    I have a similar weirdness. I’m an inbetweenie anyway – fat enough for a solidly “overweight” BMI, to prefer fat-friendly clothing stores, and to get the occasional “helpful” comment from family members (some of whom might comment anyway even if I were dangerously underweight), but as a curvy and tall size 14, I still get by in the upper ranges of some standard stores, I don’t get heckled or aggressively body-policed consistently, and I sometimes conveniently “forget” that I am fat when I’m having an off day. Looking in a mirror is a strange affair, because I will either be surprised that I don’t look as fat as I thought I was or that I look fatter than I thought I was, and either I feel like I’ve failed to pass as thin or I’m wrongfully appropriating the fat experience. Overall I wish I was just better at living in the body I’m actually in.

  13. Jadey: I’m wrongfully appropriating the fat experience.

    I can’t really speak to the in-betweeny experience because I’ve only been an in-betweeny once, and that was after my awful diet in high school (though I do remember the suckage of finding clothes). But the only time I get angry about appropriation is when in-betweenies try to dominate conversations about fat acceptance and when they act like all our experiences are basically the same. I think that as long as you acknowledge that things tend to suck worse the fatter you get, you’re probably doing fine.

  14. I really like this. I’m never been overweight, but I 100% agree that your size is not an indicator of body contentment.

    Just out of curiosity how do you feel about Jess Weiner’s (former body image advocate) recent article in Glamour that intertwines health with weight (when they are separate issues – that can sometimes overlap, but are in fact individual)?

  15. “Wait, yes I am. And holy shit, someone just compared your body to that of a fucking goddess! Why the fuck are you freaking out?!”

    Complimentary, yes — but there’s no reason for thinking it’s a representation of a goddess (or a fertility charm, or a pornographic statuette, as people also like to claim); archaeologists calling it Venus doesn’t make it so. My favorite baseless speculation is that it’s a woman’s self portrait, done looking down at herself; that is what it looks like and it also explains why the breasts and belly got so much more detail than the face.

  16. Kat: I 100% agree that your size is not an indicator of body contentment.

    Actually, that was part of what I was looking at for the above term paper. I was researching language that people use to describe fat people, and found that the level of offense people took towards fat and euphemisms for fat were not actually correlated with BMI, but with a perception that their body deviated strongly from the norm. It was pretty interesting, though I will admit that I only had 55 participants and they were all white college students in the US (age 18-22).

    Kat: Jess Weiner

    Ugh, this made me really angry, actually. Since my response would just be full of curse words and unintelligble things like ARGLHGL!! I will direct you to some great responses from and Marianne Kirby.

  17. My boyfriend and are are both openly fat with each other and other people. We enjoy it, we also enjoy laughing at people who are uncomfortable with it.

    Being fat and having fun with it is so much more fun than longing to be thin. Last month we had T-Shirts made with his face on them that say “Fat Guy Elitism” They are pretty amazing.

    I’m fat, sometimes it’s funny, sometimes it isn’t but it is still always me.

  18. So, fat acceptance = clearly the way to go. And I admire everything you’re writing about, how you’re integrating your politics into your life, and particularly the awesome anecdote you open with. 😉

    I have to say, though, specific weights remain an eating disorder trigger for me and other people I’ve met. I understand the political good you hope to do with them. It’s just not uncomplicated, and I think it’s sometimes useful to point that out.

  19. Mandolin: I have to say, though, specific weights remain an eating disorder trigger for me and other people I’ve met. I understand the political good you hope to do with them. It’s just not uncomplicated, and I think it’s sometimes useful to point that out.

    Would you prefer if I put a TW for discussion of specific weights?

  20. Shoshie, your posts just get more and more awesome!

    Sonia: The American girl instantly reacted like someone had deeply insulted her or something. She maintained her composure at the house but the next day at work she was crying for a couple of hours. According to her calling someone fat in the US was equivalent to calling a black guy the n-word.

    No. Only a White USian with some really deep-sitted body image issues would equate being called fat with being called a nigger.

  21. Angel H.: No. Only a White USian with some really deep-sitted body image issues would equate being called fat with being called a nigger.

    Quoted for Goddamn truth.

    I will also say that, even though I compared the word fat with the word Jew, queer, and woman, the feelings I get when called those things in a derogatory fashion are different and they evoke different fears and hurt.

  22. I’ve been openly fat for quite a while, my mother probably had much to do with that, as she was also openly fat when I was growing up. She was so funny about it too, I remember one especially hilarious time when she joked that she was considering going to a tanning salon because she had a hard time getting the undersides of the fat rolls to tan evenly with the topsides. We laughed at the possible reactions from the tanning clerks, laughed at the way the world would be disapproving of, or confused by, us laughing at it. (no, she wasn’t actually into tanning, it was all joke)

    I call myself fat whenever I describe myself, and sometimes people respond with the “oh c’mon, you’re not fat!” and it drives me nuts, (maddeningly, that reaction often comes from people online who’ve only seen me from the shoulders up) because they assume it is me expressing unhappiness with my body; they react to the word ‘fat’ as if it is a synonym for ‘disgusting’, as if I’m calling myself disgusting. The nerve!

    I had a steady fella a good while back who, if I referred to my ‘fat ass’, would say “it’s not fat, it’s perfect” and I would say, “they aren’t mutually exclusive you know”. He never did get the concept, so I got rid of him.

  23. *fat solidarity fist-bump*

    Shoshie, I LOVE THIS POST!

    I’m a fat dyke, my partner is a fat dyke. I spent the first 30 years of my life poisoned by the dogma of an eating-disordered, disordered-eating mother. Hated myself, hurt myself, made myself ill trying to be smaller.

    In the dialect of my people I am a “fat lass”, but finally a pretty happy one. I’m pretty much bed-bound, I’m on several medications that make weight gain as easy as smelling food, and I have PCOS and can’t take metformin any more, so I’m never going to be not-fat.

    I’m only happier because my amazing, adorable partner deprogrammed me. Horrified by the various forms of abuse I’d suffered (until I managed to escape, aged 26) she patiently and slowly showed me the many ways in which everything I thought I knew about myself was wrong. Turns out I’m not evil, or idle, or greedy, or pathetic. I just didn’t know that

    So now we’re happily, openly fat. Life is too fucking short and painful (we both have disabilities and chronic health issues) to add shame on top of it.

    I’m determined to love myself as best I can, regardless of the package I’m in.

  24. My boyfriend has been with me while I discovered what Fat Acceptance was all about, he has learned and grown along with me. He knows he can call me fat and it’s loving and affectionate. We both love how my jeans hug my very large ass. We regularly joke about “allllllla this” as I do a little dance and motion to my whole body. I’m fat, we both know it. I don’t have to worry about what he thinks of my body and he doesn’t have to worry about accidentally saying something about my body that will hurt my feelings. Thanks for writing this post!

  25. I am an inbetweenie in a family of moderately fat-positive fat people and I find myself sometimes baffled by the way smaller people compulsively correct my own statements about my body.

    For one, being fat is a part of my identity as much as other identity markers like race. i have always been this way, my whole family is this way, good or bad I just AM this way.

    People will even try to comfort me about things I am unabashedly positive about. I have really large thighs that developed around the same time as my breasts and I feel the same way about them as I do about my breasts: they are soft bits of flesh that serve as secondary sex characteristics and lots of potential partners seem to view them that way as well. I can’t believe how many people respond to my POSITIVE comments about my thighs with statements of “they’re not that big!” Ummm… yes they ARE and I like it that way!

  26. Angel H.:
    Shoshie, your posts just get more and more awesome!

    No. Only a White USian with some really deep-sitted body image issues would equate being called fat with being called a nigger.

    As much as agree with the sentiment that the two are not equivalent, it seems like you ruin your argument by starting the sentence ‘Only a member of x race, from x country, with x specific psychological problems…’ when you could have just as easily said something like “only a complete shithead would equate being called fat with being called a nigger.”

  27. Fat Steve: it seems like you ruin your argument by starting the sentence ‘Only a member of x race, from x country, with x specific psychological problems…’ when you could have just as easily said something like “only a complete shithead would equate being called fat with being called a nigger.”

    In my experience, as a fat, white USian, I’ve only seen white USians make this comparison or say such stupid things as “fat is the last remaining prejudice!” or whathaveyou. So, no, I don’t think it ruins Angel H.’s argument.

  28. As much as I try to accept my weight it’s very hard. I am a total yoyo when it comes to diet and I know that’s even more unhealthy than being overweight. During one of my upward weight swings was when I started calling myself Fat Steve, and kept calling myself that even when it didn’t completely apply. But I can’t hide from the fact that when I weighed myself today for the first time in months and saw I weighed 220lbs (I’m 6′ and no muscleman, so that’s 40-50 lbs over my optimum weight) I started crying.

  29. Also, I’m delighted to see the number of people who say they grew up with openly fat parents and role models!

  30. Shoshie: In my experience, as a fat, white USian, I’ve only seen white USians make this comparison or say such stupid things as “fat is the last remaining prejudice!” or whathaveyou.So, no, I don’t think it ruins Angel H.’s argument.

    It was the ‘ONLY’ that ruined the argument…had she even said it was ‘typical of white USians’, I would have thought it was valid

  31. Fat Steve: As much as agree with the sentiment that the two are not equivalent, it seems like you ruin your argument by starting the sentence ‘Only a member of x race, from x country, with x specific psychological problems…’ when you could have just as easily said something like “only a complete shithead would equate being called fat with being called a nigger.”

    The reason I made that qualifier was because, according to Sonia a white, USian did make it. Also, didn’t we cover #12 in the James Anderson thread?

  32. PrettyAmiable:
    I’ll bet Angel totally appreciates being told how zie can respond to racism.

    I guess I didn’t understand her point, I didn’t think she was criticizing racism. I thought she was just criticizing the poor analogy and the over-sensitivity of someone who would react to being called ‘fat’ by being offended as black person would be if they were called the n-word.

  33. Fat Steve: I guess I didn’t understand her point, I didn’t think she was criticizing racism. I thought she was just criticizing the poor analogy and the over-sensitivity of someone who would react to being called ‘fat’ by being offended as black person would be if they were called the n-word.

    False equivilancies to marginalized groups are really hurtful and perpetuate oppression, in this case, racism. So now you know.

  34. Shoshie: False equivilancies to marginalized groups are really hurtful and perpetuate oppression, in this case, racism.So now you know.

    You don’t have to tell me that, I just read the thing to quickly and responded in haste. I thought she was referring to the way the girl spent the entire day crying as if she had actually been called something as horrible as the n-word. I now realize Angel was talking about the USian girl’s comment, not her behavior, in which case I totally get that it’s about racism. I’m a careless reader, not a total dick.

  35. Great post, Shoshie. And really inspiring. I’ve lived in NYC so long, and I have to say, I think I’ve become more body dysmorphic by living here. I will also confess, although I’m a thin woman (some say very thin), I struggle daily with food, run like my life depended on it (I run marathons to keep my craziness at bay), I am probably overall a much less happy person than I was when I was several sizes bigger and 30 lbs. heavier. My husband would agree with that, and he used to tell me I was beautiful when I was not thin. Anyway, it was refreshing to read your post. My 40-year-old friends seem to be getting thinner and thinner, and yet not finding any inner happiness by doing so.

  36. Sonia:
    In India, for a lot of the older people at least, fatter is better. The younger people are more influenced by the Western media but the ideal body size even for them is at least 4 sizes above the US.

    I had a American colleague who was in India for a couple of months on an assignment who visited a friend’s house a couple of times and the friend’s grandmom thought of complimenting her by saying you must be enjoying Indian food because she looked plumper.

    The American girl instantly reacted like someone had deeply insulted her or something. She maintained her composure at the house but the next day at work she was crying for a couple of hours. According to her calling someone fat in the US was equivalent to calling a black guy the n-word.

    Sonia, great insight! I am married to an Indian man (who thinks my pot belly is sexy – YAY!). When my mother-in-law and aunts-in-law came for a visit, I made comments about my weight that would be very typical for a girl born and bred in the U.S. culture of weight-obsession to make. They thought I was nuts, and now every time I talk to her on the phone, she tells me to eat well! Can you believe that?!?! Eat well!! My own mother had me on Weight Watchers at age 11.

  37. Jadey: I’m an inbetweenie anyway – fat enough for a solidly “overweight” BMI, to prefer fat-friendly clothing stores, and to get the occasional “helpful” comment from family members (some of whom might comment anyway even if I were dangerously underweight), but as a curvy and tall size 14, I still get by in the upper ranges of some standard stores, I don’t get heckled or aggressively body-policed consistently. . .

    I find myself in the same position, and I think this is a very interesting issue. I have long been troubled by the knowledge that I eat well and am not hindered by my body, but still feel fat. Recently I’ve decided that since I’m never going to quit eating the foods I love or change my habits otherwise–which is fine, I don’t have a problem to fix–I just need to accept my body as it is. It’s been going pretty well, and internally I consider myself to have accepted being a fat person. The thing is, I’m not really a fat person (I’m also sure as hell not a thin person). Even having accepted my size, I feel guilty classifying myself with a group to which I don’t really belong. I confess only to my closest friends that I feel fat, because I’m embarrassed about it–and then, only friends who I am certain are skinnier than me. Even without intending to pass judgment on others, I would never make a comment about being fat in public for fear that someone heavier than me–and self-conscious about it–would be hurt. The best I can do is accept myself for who I am, but it’s difficult in the present environment of body politics.

  38. * She’s your parasitic twin. Some day she will break free of you and run around killing people, X Files style.

    You don’t eat her, but she might eat you. So really as a metaphor it’s not very reassuring. Let the thin woman inside come out? Um…

  39. I totally loved this post, first and foremost! Awesome and inspiring. I’m with some of the other commenters on struggling with the language of fat acceptance. I am not fat, but as a woman of color who does not fit what I perceived to be the USian norms for women’s figures, I love and identify with the fat acceptance movement. I think the idea of reclaiming and destigmatizing the word fat is amazing. However, I always have this nagging awareness that someone might see me and think that I mean fat as an insult rather than as a neutral descriptor that is not contradictory with other positive descriptors.

    I have friends who are fat, but are not down with fat acceptance and are constantly trying to lose weight or are on the defensive about any comments with any word that might suggest that they are fat. So it makes me feel like, who am I to talk about fat acceptance? Should I just keep it to myself? Part of me wants to share this wonderful ideology that I find empowering but the other part of me worries that this comes across as condescending or as cultural appropriation.

    I feel like body acceptance is for everyone, and I feel like fat acceptance, in particular, is an important part of that even for me as a skinny-ish person. Part of this is personal for me because my mother, with her own good intentions wrapped up in her own issues, had several interventions with me when I was growing up in which she tried to shame me into eating less so that I wouldn’t be fat. I recalled recently an intervention she had, which she involved her sister and several of my cousins in when I reached a certain benchmark in weight. However, to look at me now, there’s no way for other people to see that past, to know that my perceived fatness or potential fatness was treated as a personal failing of mine within my family because that experience is invisible now. It just leaves me in an awkward position, I suppose.

  40. Shoshie, I envy you.

    My not-really-fat husband refuses to believe that it’s not a trick question.

    I keep hoping that he’ll believe me someday. 🙂

    Hi, MadGastronomer!

  41. I’m a permanent in-betweenie (mostly due to height) whose weight went up significantly due to entering the final year of a thesis. Sitting down for eighteen hours a day while eating almost constantly to stem the boredom = weight gain. I had, and have, no problem in identifying as fat; it was actually fascinating to watch my body change. But I’ve had to work quite hard to reprogramme friends and family into realising that ‘fat’ does not mean ‘ugly’. They’d get very upset if I described myself as fat, or fatter, thinking that the use of such a word signalled self-hatred, or deep-rooted unhappiness. Their reactions really highlighted, to me, the heavy baggage that ‘fat’ as a description carries.

  42. I’m wondering if you or somebody could direct me to some appropriate resources for a couple to read together on this issue.

    Let me start by saying that my wife and I have slightly different fat situations which might each need a different approach. I’ve been overweight my entire life. My personal understanding of my body, based on numerous attempts to lose weight, is that I naturally settle 40-50 lbs over what BMI would dictate as appropriate (I know BMI is BS but it gives you an idea of where I’m at, I know the experience of very obese and in-betweeners is different) and past there, it seems to be much more difficult to lose any more weight. I ballooned a little in college because of my disgustingly unhealthy college lifestyle, and upon graduating I adopted a sensible diet and an enjoyable amount of exercise, felt much better, and lost the excess weight. So I’m relatively confident that this is natural for me. If it were just based on looks, I wouldn’t have a problem, because I think I look fine – the musclemen I see in clothes ads and video games all the time occasionally give me twinges of body envy, but I can handle it.

    However, I am plagued by the knowledge that excess body fat has been scientifically linked to risks for health issues, and there’s heart disease and diabetes in my family, and an uncle who was once fit and healthy but who became overweight to the point where it affected his ability to walk. Since I feel like the information on what is a healthy, appropriate weight for a given individual is so filtered through our anti-fat culture, I constantly doubt whether I’m healthy enough to avoid those health issues I’ve seen in my family. My doctors always just point out the obvious, which is that I’m over the recommended number, and advise me to lose it. So where’s the scholarship about being overweight and being healthy? I need to read something that once and for all makes me feel like I’m able to keep an eye on my personal health without making it about the weight.

    My wife, on the other hand, is less “overweight” than me, but has a much bigger problem with it. She has always had a “normal” weight, but her mom is terribly anti-fat, being a person who was stick-skinny her entire life and always told my wife that she was more “solid” or “stocky” because she took after her father’s Italian side. She also openly mocks fat people. So my wife has grown up with the idea that being overweight is disgusting, and that she was destined to be overweight because she takes after that half of her family.

    After we got married she gained a little weight, as often happens to married people, and she’s been shocked, since she’s never been overweight before, and has been obsessed with trying to lose it. She’s always checking in her outfits with me before she goes out to make sure she “doesn’t look totally fat”, depriving herself of things she likes to eat, and every time she goes to the gym she says it’s so she can “not be such a disgusting fatty”. I have tried to be extremely clear that a) I am not comfortable with her discussing her weight that way and b) I love the way she looks and in fact I don’t want her to lose any weight because I think she is sexy and wonderful exactly the way she is, but I also always say she should do whatever makes her feel best. Every few weeks she gets cranky when she checks the scale and her efforts have not paid off in weight loss.

    I have a couple of problems knowing how to handle this. First, I know I only have limited power to help here because it’s her body and she needs to look the way she honestly wants to look – that is, if she’s doing anything for me or for others, we’re doing it wrong. (I suspect that what I think is not really her concern here, I think it’s other women: that is, she’s just so used to seeing fat people get judged by others that it panics her that she might be part of that population.)

    Second, I’ve already sort of been sucked into using anti-fat language: when she asks me if she “looks totally fat”, I say “no”, because what I think she’s asking is “does she look fat enough to be judged by anti-fat people as a fat person”. (Maybe I just need to beat her to the punch and tell her how awesome she looks before she asks anything!) I also point out specific things that I like about the outfit and how she looks because I want to try to shift the conversation from trying not to look like something.

    Third, she always tries to talk about it in terms of health, but I can tell that it’s not really about that – when she talks about “trying not to be a disgusting fatty” I always remind her that I think she looks great, that that’s a terrible reason to go to the gym, and I’m only going to “let her” go if she says she’s it’s about being healthy – but that’s not fooling anybody. It’s about the weight and that’s it.

    Anyway, I’m not comfortable with the way we relate to body image in our house and I want to start a conversation about feeling better about ourselves, and I’m sure somebody has written a great article that credibly addresses the health issues as well as the standard image issues, and that we can read without it seeming rude on my part for recommending it. Can someone point me to it?

  43. Doc G: However, I am plagued by the knowledge that excess body fat has been scientifically linked to risks for health issues, and there’s heart disease and diabetes in my family, and an uncle who was once fit and healthy but who became overweight to the point where it affected his ability to walk.

    Just out of interest, why do people like you not address points like this to the professionals charged with finding solutions and call for increased research into it, why direct it at a group of amateurs?

    You said before that you can’t get to the weight you feel you’d like to, so clearly that doesn’t work, why don’t you believe your own body, your own ability to recognise that and conclude limited/no application to me, something better is required?

    Just curious.

  44. Sonia, great insight! I am married to an Indian man (who thinks my pot belly is sexy – YAY!). When my mother-in-law and aunts-in-law came for a visit, I made comments about my weight that would be very typical for a girl born and bred in the U.S. culture of weight-obsession to make. They thought I was nuts, and now every time I talk to her on the phone, she tells me to eat well! Can you believe that?!?! Eat well!! My own mother had me on Weight Watchers at age 11.

    Totally believe that. Indian mothers and grandmothers pride themselves on making you eat till you burst. The general impression with skinny people is ‘they didn’t get anything to eat’. I am naturally skinny and that is a source of trouble to my mom and other close female relatives forever.

  45. Sonia: Totally believe that. Indian mothers and grandmothers pride themselves on making you eat till you burst. The general impression with skinny people is ‘they didn’t get anything to eat’. I am naturally skinny and that is a source of trouble to my mom and other close female relatives forever.

    That’s really interesting, because Jewish mothers and grandmothers have that reputation too (and it’s pretty accurate, in my experience). But, as much as my grandmother would try to stuff me silly, she’d always comment negatively about my weight. I think it’s an old world/new world tension. Jewish life definitely revolves around food, which was often scarce in the poverty of the shtetl. Hence, “Eat, eat! You look so thin!” But there’s also this desire to blend in, to look like a proper American, and that means being thin. I think that Ashkenazi (I can’t really speak to Sephardi or Mizrahi) Jewish women tend to have a lot of anxiety around body image, including weight, curly hair, and Semitic noses. A couple times when I was on retreats, we actually blew a circuit from all the girls straightening their hair. Though, for the sake of full disclosure, I have straight-ish hair.

    But anyways, because of this tension, I never felt comfortable “coming out” to my grandmother. I did manage to tell my parents that I stopped dieting, and they don’t particularly hassle me about it, which is nice.

  46. I’ve been dipping my toe into Fat Acceptance. I’ve been very into body image issues as a whole for a long time and health at every size more recently.
    What I’m uncomfortable with isn’t the identifying as fat part, it’s the follow up, “Oh don’t say that! You aren’t fat.” Um, yes I am.
    Therefore, I’m not really “out” about my fatness (inasmuch as someone who is fat can be not “out.”) I don’t say it very often because I don’t want to have to go off on a tangent about how I am reclaiming the word and get into that whole business, because it’s tiring, but I totally value and appreciate those who are able to be this voice.

  47. alynn: I don’t say it very often because I don’t want to have to go off on a tangent about how I am reclaiming the word and get into that whole business, because it’s tiring, but I totally value and appreciate those who are able to be this voice.

    For sure. FA is completely exhausting work and I definitely don’t do it all the time. Like, I’m pretty much not out as fat accepting at all at work. I’ll sometimes refer to myself as a fat chick, but it’s definitely not the same as my level of being out with my friends and husband.

  48. as a recovered anorexic, I think body acceptance is the hardest part. basically accepting that your body can and will change, I think.
    I’m not a fat woman, but I found this to be very poignant. The more people who own the term, the less it can be used in a negative way; c’mon people, it’s just an adjective!
    I can’t believe I lived my life in fear of an adjective…sheesh.

  49. What I’m uncomfortable with isn’t the identifying as fat part, it’s the follow up, “Oh don’t say that! You aren’t fat.”

    What frustrates me about hearing the “you’re not fat” response in my own life is that the significant majority of the time (easily 80%) I’m the recipient of such a statement, the speaker is someone who is thinner than I am. When that happens, it’s hard for me to view the statement as anything other than (unconscious and well-meaning, perhaps) fat hate.

  50. Just chiming in to say I love this post, thank you.
    I’ve been in a monogamous relationship for almost 13 years now, and in that time my body, and how I feel about it, has gone through some pretty big changes. By contrast, my now- husband’s weight and his body image hasn’t altered a great deal. It’s been interesting moving from being quite ashamed of my body to becoming body positive and into fat acceptance within a relationship. His appreciation of my body hasn’t wavered but the language we both use has – although he still doesn’t call me fat outright. That will probably change as I say it myself more and more.

  51. @Tori I totally agree. I am fat, it’s undeniable, but I’m in that segment where I “pass” in that many people would most likely use “bigger” to describe me or some other euphemism. They think that by not calling me fat, they’re being nice because fat automatically means gross to them. What they don’t get is that I want to use the term more neutrally and remove this negative connotation.

  52. @Tori I totally agree. I am fat, it’s undeniable, but I’m in that segment where I “pass” in that many people would most likely use “bigger” to describe me or some other euphemism. They think that by not calling me fat, they’re being nice because fat automatically means gross to them. What they don’t get is that I want to use the term more neutrally and remove this negative connotation.

  53. I have a slightly different question than DocG’s: does anyone have a recommendation for resources for training medical professionals to talk to patients about behavioral changes while being fat accepting? In particular, anything that’s directed toward cardiologists and other physicians who see a lot of patients who may genuinely need to increase their level of physical activity or adjust what kind of food they eat (e.g. to help reduce cholesterol levels and thereby avoid medication), but who shouldn’t be having this advice at all understood as a message to “lose weight,” because the number on the scale is not the issue.

  54. I will admit that “You’re not fat!” is first response to come to my mind whenever another woman tell me she’s fat or needs to lose weight — even if the other woman clearly is fat. (In my defense, this hasn’t come out of my mouth in roughtly 18 years, even though it is still generally my first thought.) When another woman says, “I’m fat,” failing to contradict her seems tantamount to agreeing that she is fat, and of course, we are socialized never, ever, ever to call someone else fat. The other piece of this is that I (like many women, I suspect) spent my high school and college years among women (okay, myself among them) who spent a lot of time saying things like, “I’m so fat,” in the hopes of getting reassurance to the contrary.

    So when someone says, “I’m fat,” or “I need to lose weight,” it can be tough to read whether the person is seeking reassurance that she is not fat, or if she is insecure about it and wants to criticize herself before anyone else can, or if she is engaging in matter-of-fact fat-acceptance. The best all-purpose response I can come up with to “I’m fat!” is, “Oh, you’re beautiful!” which I think can be read as reassurance to the insecure speaker or agreement with the fat-accepting speaker. It is easier to respond to “I need to lose weight.” I usually say, “Losing weight is really hard. I have never been able to lose weight on purpose. Maybe it’s better to focus on healthy eating and less on weight?”

    But I will admit that it will always be uncomfortable to engage in discussions about weight. There is a fat woman in my office who constantly comments on how “thin” or “tiny” I am, which always leaves me at a loss for words. It is clear that she means it as a compliment, but saying “thank you” seems wrong. It seems worse to contradict her and say, “Oh no, I’ve gained 20 pounds since I’ve started working here and I can’t seem to get rid of it.” I have kind of settled on a blatant lie: “Well, it doesn’t necessarily mean I am a healthy eater. I still can’t seem to quite give up my chocolate ice cream.”

    Ugh. I just read this and realized that it comes off as all about me. What I am getting at is that it is very difficult to navigate around fat-hate when these issues come up, because it is so deeply ingrained in our culture and well-nigh universal. It really affects all women adversely, even the non-fat, although obviously in different ways and to different degrees.

  55. I will admit that “You’re not fat!” is first response to come to my mind whenever another woman tell me she’s fat or needs to lose weight — even if the other woman clearly is fat.

    Also, if the person doesn’t seem to have suffered the serious oppressions of being fat (medical professionals ignoring her actual ills so they can lecture on weight loss; inability to buy clothing except through specialty stores; etc.), as opposed to the fairly standard burden nearly all women carry of societal expectation that they look like Kate Moss, is it legitimate for that person to identify as fat? I mean, wouldn’t it be problematic for a brunette white woman to say, “Oh, I’m so dark” like she’s suffering the oppression that actual people of color do?

  56. Also, if the person doesn’t seem to have suffered the serious oppressions of being fat (medical professionals ignoring her actual ills so they can lecture on weight loss; inability to buy clothing except through specialty stores; etc.), as opposed to the fairly standard burden nearly all women carry of societal expectation that they look like Kate Moss, is it legitimate for that person to identify as fat?

    How does one tell what another person “seems” to have experienced, though?

  57. One thing that mystifies me about the Health-at-any-size claimants is the amount of complaining they do about doctors. If you are healthy you don’t need doctors. What the doctors think doesn’t matter if you are healthy.

  58. Sonia:
    One thing that mystifies me about the Health-at-any-size claimants is the amount of complaining they do about doctors. If you are healthy you don’t need doctors. What the doctors think doesn’t matter if you are healthy.

    I am a bona fide “Health at an size claimant,” but I wasn’t always. There was a time when I believed the hype on local news stations’ stories on a *GASP* EPIDEMIC, complete with headless bodies walking… I was freaking out because I had gained back the 50 lbs I once lost, so I thought I had adult on-set diabetes and high blood pressure, *for no real reason other than that is what “they” say on television. I am “morbidly obese” according to BMI charts (so are women size 12, though). So I ran to the doctor (okay I didn’t run, I speed-walked–surely you can view me doing this with my head cut off on KMOV).
    TO MY UTTER ASTONISHMENT: (age 32 255 lbs 5’5 BMI off da chartz) I have perfect blood pressure, my lipids are great, glucose awesome. So, I have no complaints about my PCP!

    I just wish with my whole heart that I could have a nice bf egalitarian relationship where fat doesn’t mean I am horribly disfigured and going to die. I am jealous of your relationship Shoshie! Sounds fulfilling and FUN!!

  59. Sonia:
    One thing that mystifies me about the Health-at-any-size claimants is the amount of complaining they do about doctors. If you are healthy you don’t need doctors. What the doctors think doesn’t matter if you are healthy.

    I think you’re oversimplifying too much here. Health isn’t a dichotomy of “healthy” versus “not healthy;” there are a lot of factors involved. Some of them are under an individual’s direct control; some aren’t.

    For instance, I have endometriosis and have since menarche (which was 16 years and just over a hundred pounds ago). I need doctors — or health care providers of some sort — to help manage pain and keep me from hemorrhaging every cycle. However, I also need them to understand that the majority of my symptoms are neither alleviated or exacerbated by changes in fitness habits or physical size — and that focusing on my weight (or diet or exercise, for that matter) is not actually managing the condition.

    Additionally, a lot of folks seek health care providers for non-sick care — contraception, prenatal care, vaccinations, work physicals, etc. It’s not a matter of people only needing to visit doctors when they are sick.

  60. Laurie:
    There is a fat woman in my office who constantly comments on how “thin” or “tiny” I am, which always leaves me at a loss for words.It is clear that she means it as a compliment, but saying “thank you” seems wrong.

    Totally agree. I feel really uncomfortable when people comment on my thinness as if it’s a compliment, it makes me want to say “But I’m unhealthy,” or the wittier, “And you have blonde/brown/etc hair.” I realise these “compliments” come from either insecurity or simply what we’ve been socialised to believe, so I don’t want to make the person feel rude, or imply that I have a problem with my own body, but it definitely feels very awkward. If I was charismatic, I might say something like, “I know you mean that as a compliment, so thank you, but my worth has nothing to do with my weight and I would prefer if you didn’t comment on it,” but that feels rude too.

    Much worse, though, is when other thin people assume that because I am not fat, I will be automatically complicit in their fat-hate. But that’s easy to react to, because I can rely on those lovely things we call statistics and facts. Or I can just tell the person to eff off.

  61. Wow, lots of more recent comments here. So, Tori, I agree that it’s problematic to assume what other people have experienced. But, I do think that it’s problematic for thin people to co-opt the struggles of fat people. It’s something that I experience quite a lot, actually, and it’s very frustrating.

    Here’s the thing: fat isn’t something that is hidden. It’s right out there in the open. You can look at me and see that I’m a death fat (ie morbidly obese). And, as much as BMI is bunk, and thin-but-heavy people will receive fat-shaming, it’s a different experience from those of us who are fat (as in, have much adipose tissue). We are the ones who get cow called by strangers and receive the brunt of the hostility from doctors. We are the ones who are having stores refuse our hard-earned money. And I’m not saying that thin women or in-betweenies never ever experience these things, but geez, someone has actually tried to run me over while I was crossing the street and eating a donut. I’ve had doctors try to deny me birth control. I almost cried when I saw my current doctor about being short of breath, and she actually believed me that this experience was atypical and gave me an inhaler for bronchitis. Because other doctors would have just ascribed it to my weight.

    So, long-winded version made short: Fat is something you can see. In general, the fatter people are, the more fat-based oppression they experience. For instance, I’m lucky and don’t have to worry too much about hitting the weight limit for chairs and medical equipment and stuff. There are also still a few brick-and-mortar stores that carry my size clothing. Because I’m on the smaller side of death-fat.

    On doctors: Anna is right. Healthy people need doctors too. Healthy people get the flu. Healthy people need vaccines. Healthy people need birth control and pap smears and annual check-ups. Healthy people need epi pens. Healthy people get pregnant and need pre-and-post natal care. And I think it’s super important to remember that health is sort of a continuum. I consider myself pretty healthy, but I have PCOS and seasonal allergies (*coughack*), some chronic pain issues, and a tendency towards seasonal depression (CURSE YOU, SEATTLE). All of which require health care of some sort, but the point of HAES is not that all fat people are healthy or that everyone can be healthy at every size, because that’s pretty untrue and ableist. But the point of HAES is that health means different things to different people. And the choices you make towards your health care are going to be different, not just based on your size, but based on a million different factors. So it’s extremely silly for doctors to take this one particular factor and place it at the top of the list for cause and treatment. What I find particularly great about HAES is that it places a huge importance on mental and emotional health. What use is dieting to me if it makes my emotional quality of life TERRIBLE. Even if I can lose weight, what if I go back to disordered eating? That’s terrifying and potentially quite harmful. Not in line with my current health needs.

    To L and Laurie-
    I think that this is really tricky. I would never lecture someone who faces oppression that I don’t on their own oppression because that seems really icky. I’m happy to bash my white friends with the clue-hammer when they say racist shit. And I’m totally happy to call my friends when they say fatphobic shit (one of my friends once was going on about those gross “morbidly obese” people. I shut him up fast when I informed him that I was morbidly obese). But I don’t think it’s my place to lecture someone who’s non-white about race. I don’t think it’s my place to lecture someone who’s trans about trans issues. Because I feel like it really just continues to enforce kyriarchal balances of power, you know? I might recommend some reading to them or something, or say something polite-but-contrary, just to show that I disagree.

    Regarding people commenting on weight, I usually try to stay polite-but-dismissive. Like, if I do lose a bit of weight and people comment on it, I might say, “Oh, I guess so.” and shrug. So not lying, but also showing that I don’t place much importance on it.

  62. You’re right, Sloshie, in that it’s totally wrong for a thin person to lecture a fat person about weight politics.

    I know I have thin privilege and I can’t understand what it would be like not to have it, so I have no right at all telling fat people how to feel about these things. Not that I ever would have, but I have almost wanted to – the thing I find so difficult about it is that it took me 20 years of struggling to start to accept myself and to even begin to take care of my health (which is not in good shape), so When I’m complimented on my thinness, I feel like all my struggles are just considered moot because I’m not fat.

    Does it mean I don’t have privilege? No. Does it give me the right to tell fat people how to think and feel about these things? Not at all. It’s something I just have to move past and deal with on my own.

  63. Oh, and I am NOT comparing my inner issues to the abuse that fat people experience. I just want to be clear about that.

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