I no longer know myself. January 13, 2011 Jill It turns out that I’m actually a Cancer, not a Leo. And that is just wrong, because I am such a Leo! Pompous and patronizing! Bossy and interfering! Dogmatic and intolerant! HOW could this have happened? Nothing makes sense anymore.
“because I am such a Leo! Pompous and patronizing! Bossy and interfering! Dogmatic and intolerant! ” And thank God for Leos. That’s what they bring to the table – “Shut UP everyone – enough bickering! Here’s what we’e going to do….” A Leo decides where the party is going to be – wherever she is! I think even a non-Leo has to be able to play the part to be a good moderator, the same way you have to be an a bit of an autocrat to be a good bartender. Someone has to say when the drunks get cut off.
Welcome to being a Cancer – we’re all moody bitches here! It’s a grand life, but stay away from Scorpios. Oh fuck, looks like I’m a Gemini now – time to brush up on being a flighty narcissist.
My dad’s a cancer, and he’s pompous, patronizing, bossy, interfering, dogmatic and intolerant. So perhaps there is hope?
I’m a Virgo now? Modest and shy Meticulous and reliable Practical and diligent Intelligent and analytical Fussy and a worrier Overcritical and harsh Perfectionist and conservative Um, I want to be a Scorpio again.
Well that is some BS. I (was) a Leo too. Growing up, I didn’t really fit the Leo type, which says I am supposed to be a natural leader who loves the spotlight, which hasn’t been anything like me until adulthood…and now it’s all wrong? Now I’m Cancer?
Knowing your sign may have an effect! The psychologist Hans Eysenck (he of the IQ tests) did some research on astrology. He found that, on average, people who were aware of their sun sign got a score on an extraversion scale which was consistent with their sign’s attributes. The results broadly showed a zig-zag pattern on a line graph, with Air/Fire signs extrovert, Water/ Earth introverted. The results weren’t replicated with a group of people who were unfamilar with their sign and with astrology. (Sagittarius Rising – curiosity about ideas. I’ll keep that š
No! No! No! A thousand times no! I’ve always been a Libra–even if I’m the first day of Libra–and I’ve had to fight against people trying to put me in Virgo. I am a Libra. I share my birthday with John Coltrane, Julio Iglesias, Ani DiFranco, Ray Charles, and Bruce Springsteen. You’re telling me THE BOSS is a Virgo? No, screw that. I refuse. Worst day ever.
so what do you do if your bday is one of the “boundary” dates? easy enough to figure out if it falls in between, but for someone with a bday of sept 16, or dec 17th, what are you??
I don’t understand why this is suddenly a thing. I read an astrology book explaining this shift around 1975! No, seriously. This was in a book in 1975. Why is it a “discovery” now? In fact, how astrologers have been answering this issue all these years is that you’re not actually a “Leo” because the constellation “Leo” is in the sky. The constellations are very far away and not considered the main points of influence. You’re considered a Leo because of the position of the planets of the solar system, and of the Sun and Moon, during the Leo date range. While the date range for the positions of the constellations has changed, the positions of the planets have not. You’re still a Leo.
All bull. I don’t mean astrology: I mean astronomers trotting out the procession of the equinoxes every few years to try to invalidate thousands of years of gathered knowledge (and no, this doesn’t just pertain to sun-sign crap but REAL astrology). Most astronomers don’t know anything about astrology, yet they persist in calling it hokum. Too bad… actual scientists don’t usually make up their minds without looking at data. The only way to know where all your planets and other sensitive points fall in your chart is to have your chart done based on the place and time, as exact as possible, of your birth. (I’m pretty sure one can still do this, for free, at astrodienst.com .) The Sun doesn’t automatically change signs at midnight local time on a given 12 dates per year — and sometimes the change occurs the calendar-day before or after whatever sun-sign rag you’re reading tells you is the “cusp” date. If you were born a Leo by sun sign, you’re still a Leo. The tropical zodiac, used by most Western astrologers, has nothing to do with the position of constellations.
Wtf?! I’m not being a Virgo, no way. My god, switching from Libra to Virgo is like believing for your entire life that you’re French and then finding out your from Ohio!
I am now a Ophiuchus, the rejected 13th sign. Although, the list of attributes I found sounds more like me than Sagittarius and also awesome. Check it: interpreter of dreams, vivid premonitions, serpent holder, fame – either grand, or completely misunderstood, the number twelve holds great significance, and of course: tax assessor.
bellacoker: Wtf?!Iām not being a Virgo, no way.My god, switching from Libra to Virgo is like believing for your entire life that youāre French and then finding out your from Ohio! I feel your ex-Libra pain.
I’ve also switched from Leo to Cancer, and this actually makes sense in my case. I am nothing like a Leo.
Ophiuchus?! What the fuck is an Ophiuchus? So I don’t even get a real sign, just some made-up shit the Babylonians didn’t even– Wait, the snake bearer? That sounds kind of cool.
I was a Cancer which is a pretty damn chill sign but now I’m a Gemini and I have no idea what that means.
This unyielding Aries refuses to believe she is now a Pisces. (And I can’t imaged the strong-willed women with whom I share a birthday — Aretha Franklin, Gloria Steinem, and Flannery O’Connor — as water signs either.)
As a textbook example of an Aries, I refuse to change. *stamps foot* I reject this new Zodiac, and insist they can take my fire sign when they pry it from my cold dead hands.
WTF. I’m an Aquarius now. I liked being a Pisces. I fit my sign perfectly. It’s sad how put off I am, because I don’t even believe in this. Also, Kathy, water signs are perfectly capable of being strong-willed.
Everyone can breathe easy. This has been debunked http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/astrology-controversy-zodiac-sign-wrong/story?id=12609264
Lara Emily Foley: Everyone can breathe easy. This has been debunkedhttp://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/astrology-controversy-zodiac-sign-wrong/story?id=12609264 Thank you. I knew I was a Pisces, dammit.
Weird thing though I’m a Scorpio under what would have been the new system I would have been a Libra, when I looked up the basic characteristics of each sign, both of them applied equally in a creepy sort of way.
Nahida: Itās sad how put off I am, because I donāt even believe in this. Ha, that was pretty much my reaction too.
What’s with all the Virgo hate? š Okay, okay. It is a boring sign. According to this, I’m now a Leo. Unless I can switch to Libra, I’m staying a Virgo.
*Big sigh of relief that it’s not real* Because now I don’t have to get my bow and arrow tattoo covered by an Ophiuchus symbol…whatever that may be.
‘Pompous and patronizing! Bossy and interfering! Dogmatic and intolerant! “ I’m a Leo, and I am all of those things EXCEPT for bossy and interfering. (After all, being not-a-feminist, I prefer to sit back and let things take their course until the moment is ripe. š I also don’t believe in astrology. Perhaps I should. . ? š
Yeah, what’s with all the Virgo-directed derision? It’s a good sign; come on over! I like being a Virgo. It describes me really well, even if I don’t put much stock in astrology (which now, apparently, is telling me I’m a Leo). Anyway, I don’t understand the “debunking.” The article seems to be saying, not that it’s not a good readjustment, but that it’s nothing new.
Quite frankly, finding out I was the wrong sign all these years would have explained quite a lot about my life. Yet here I am, still an ill-fitted Leo.
As an astronomer, I have to respond. Chris: All bull. I donāt mean astrology: I mean astronomers trotting out the procession of the equinoxes every few years to try to invalidate thousands of years of gathered knowledge (and no, this doesnāt just pertain to sun-sign crap but REAL astrology). Most astronomers donāt know anything about astrology, yet they persist in calling it hokum. Too badā¦ actual scientists donāt usually make up their minds without looking at data. Could you please provide any such data that indicates that astrology is not hokum? Can you name a physical mechanism that would explain why the position of the planets influence the personalities of people on Earth? More importantly, by what physical mechanism would the effect of the position of planets travel through time – ie, why does the position of the planets the moment I was born affect the kind of day I will have today? We don’t “look at data” about astrology because there IS no scientific data. If you can collect such data, more power to you. You would be ridiculously famous. But at the current moment, there is no scientific theory that explains astrology. That’s why I don’t believe in it. Chris: The only way to know where all your planets and other sensitive points fall in your chart is to have your chart done based on the place and time, as exact as possible, of your birth. (Iām pretty sure one can still do this, for free, at astrodienst.com .) The Sun doesnāt automatically change signs at midnight local time on a given 12 dates per year ā and sometimes the change occurs the calendar-day before or after whatever sun-sign rag youāre reading tells you is the ācuspā date. If you were born a Leo by sun sign, youāre still a Leo. The tropical zodiac, used by most Western astrologers, has nothing to do with the position of constellations. The fact is still true that over 2000 years ago, in late March, the sun was in Aries. This means that, if you were to draw a line from the Earth through the Sun, it would point towards the constellation Aries. But now, in late march, due to precession of the Earth’s tilt, if you draw that same line it now points toward Pisces instead. It’s the same effect that makes Polaris the North start NOW, but it was a different star over 2000 years ago. Since most people define your sun sign as “which constellation you point to when you draw a line from Earth through to sun” (aka which one the sun is “in”), then it HAS changed. Your point seems to be that you don’t define sun signs that way – and that’s cool. Since astrology is not a science, you can define it any way you want. But the article is still correct in stating that the sun is “in” a different constellation now than it was back in the day. I don’t want to be a killjoy, I get the fact that most people commenting don’t actually live their lives by astrology and are just being silly. That’s totally cool, I have no problem with that, astrology is a historic cultural thing so it’s fun to still be a part of it. But, as an astronomer, I had to respond to an attack on my profession. Also folks, don’t fear too much – the Earth’s precession goes in a 23,000 year cycle. So give it another 20,000 years or so and your signs will all be back in the right place. š
Antonomasia: Knowing your sign may have an effect! The psychologist Hans Eysenck (he of the IQ tests) did some research on astrology. He found that, on average, people who were aware of their sun sign got a score on an extraversion scale which was consistent with their signās attributes. The results broadly showed a zig-zag pattern on a line graph, with Air/Fire signs extrovert, Water/ Earth introverted. The results werenāt replicated with a group of people who were unfamilar with their sign and with astrology.(Sagittarius Rising ācuriosity about ideas. Iāll keep that š Oh, also to address this! This is exactly scientific evidence indicating that astrology does not matter, because the results were not reproduced when individuals were unaware of their sign/astrology. The results of those who were aware is likely an example of a self-fulfilling prophecy, very common in psychology. If astrology were actually a physical force that influences life, it would affect everyone whether you are aware of it or not. The study shows that it doesn’t.
Huh, debunked or not I kinda like my new identity as an Aries better than my old Taurus one. “Arians make good researchers and explorers due to their inquisitive nature.” Woot. …But I like my identity as a person-who-doesn’t-give-a-shit-about-silly-woo best of all. ;D
Lu: Yeah, whatās with all the Virgo-directed derision? Itās a good sign; come on over! I like being a Virgo. It describes me really well, even if I donāt put much stock in astrology (which now, apparently, is telling me Iām a Leo).Anyway, I donāt understand the ādebunking.ā The article seems to be saying, not that itās not a good readjustment, but that itās nothing new. First line from page 2 of the article “In short, your astrological sign has not changed.”
amen, julia. if there’s anybody out there that actually thinks there’s evidence behind astrology, i’d recommend reading this scientific investigation: http://scholar.google.com/scholar?cluster=6712505630869898097&hl=en&as_sdt=0,24
Wow. My birthday is one of about four dates that is Sagittarius in both calendars . . . and it’s still the Zodiac personality that’s the farthest from my actual personality. And what in the world is “ophiuchus”? The starfish?
F that, I’m staying a Bull. Double bull, actually: I’m a Taurus, and I was born in the year of the Ox.
Astrology is about subscribing to the notion that certain groups of people are inherently different, despite the fact that there’s no evidence for a difference, and plenty of evidence for no difference. (But people keep on believing there’s a difference because it’s so embedded in our culture…) I thought this blog was against that sort of thing?
HA! I always knew those signs were off. I’ve always been more a Capricorn than an Aquarius. Of course the SO makes more sense as a Taurus and no sense whatsoever as an Aries. So I think I’ll go with a mixed approach.
As a Pagan, I may give you some more perspective on your sun sign. The sun sign is your outside personality and your moon sign is your inner personality. What I mean by outer persona I mean the way people view you, or how you interact with others. You may be a Cancer to others, but you may be a Leo moon in the inside! I am a Libra sun and Gemini moon. Bad combo, because I want balance, but I am also terrible at decisions.
The zodiac has been wrong for over a hundred years. The zodiac is based on what appears at a certain point in the sky at certain times. The earth has tilted several degrees since the zodiac was originally formed, so the constellations no longer correspond to their designated times. In fact that are about a month out. So you were never a Leo. Astronomy-1 Astrology-0
AllSaintsDay: Astrology is about subscribing to the notion that certain groups of people are inherently different, despite the fact that thereās no evidence for a difference, and plenty of evidence for no difference. (But people keep on believing thereās a difference because itās so embedded in our cultureā¦)I thought this blog was against that sort of thing? This… is a stretch. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think astrology has ever been used to persecute anyone. The worst it can be is annoying.
As an ex-Aries, who is about as fiery as a soggy old sock in a rainstorm, the Piscean traditional description fits me perfectly. Also my Spouse being a Virgo now fits in the silly ol’ compati-relationship stakes if you bring Astrology into the equation. However this is nonsense and poppycock! Right…?
This has my whole Libra sense of balance and harmony thrown waaay off! I’ve read up on Virgo and although some things fit, I still truly fit the Libra attributes, therefore I can never change what I have been my whole life.
Jadey: Oh fuck, looks like Iām a Gemini now ā time to brush up on being a flighty narcissist. (Quote this comment?) I’m psyched about it, myself. I resent being an overly-sensitive Cancer. I rather look forward to my new adaptability.
Politicalguineapig: F that, Iām staying a Bull. Double bull, actually: Iām aTaurus, and I was born in the year of the Ox. Yeah me too. Taurus born in the year of the ox. Except now it says I’m an aries? (No I don’t take this stuff seriously)
Lol wow, reading up on it, I like aries a lot better and it fits me better (I think the only way I’m like a taurus is that I have artistic talent and appreciate nature, and I can be stubborn). But whatever. š
Nahida: Thisā¦ is a stretch. Correct me if Iām wrong, but I donāt think astrology has ever been used to persecute anyone. The worst it can be is annoying. In the way I mentioned, they’re pretty close. Morally, yes, one is used to persecute people while the other isn’t. They can (and do) differ in the consequences of each belief, which is why it’s far more important to eliminate sexism/racism/&c than belief in astrology. But epistemologically, they’re almost equivalent. If you think one belief is stupid, it’s kind of hypocritical to not think the other one is stupid, because all of the arguments against one apply equally well to the other. (This isn’t entirely true. There’s actually more evidence against astrology, simply because it’s easier to construct experiments like in #40, where you find people who don’t know what their sign says about them, than ones where you find people who’ve never had a gender role thrown at them.)
AllSaintsDay, you bring up an interesting point, I had never thought about it that way! AllSaintsDay: Morally, yes, one is used to persecute people while the other isnāt. But other pseudo-science has persecuted people! “She can float, she’s a witch!” If we aren’t well-armed to pick out pseudo-science from reality, how can we defend ourselves from the people that use it against us? It’s important to be able to distinguish real science from fake, so we can call people out when they make completely bull “scientific” arguments about why one race or sex is superior. It’s happened throughout history (phrenology anyone?) and still happens today.
AllSaintsDay: In the way I mentioned, theyāre pretty close. Morally, yes, one is used to persecute people while the other isnāt. They can (and do) differ in the consequences of each belief, which is why itās far more important to eliminate sexism/racism/&c than belief in astrology. But epistemologically, theyāre almost equivalent. If you think one belief is stupid, itās kind of hypocritical to not think the other one is stupid, because all of the arguments against one apply equally well to the other. (This isnāt entirely true. Thereās actually more evidence against astrology, simply because itās easier to construct experiments like in #40, where you find people who donāt know what their sign says about them, than ones where you find people whoāve never had a gender role thrown at them.) Give me a person alive on this planet today and I’ll show you a belief that they have which is not soundly supported by evidence.
AllSaintsDay: In the way I mentioned, theyāre pretty close.Morally, yes, one is used to persecute people while the other isnāt. They can (and do) differ in the consequences of each belief, which is why itās far more important to eliminate sexism/racism/&c than belief in astrology. Yes, I don’t think the day will ever come when someone tells me, “We can’t hire you because you’re a Pisces and they’re all lazy daydreamers!” (I refuse to become an Aquarius.) But that being said, I don’t think belief in astrology is something to be eliminated like sexism or racism. The fact that it has the potential to have the same effects isn’t good enough. We’d be going down a dangerous road.
Also, if we view astrology the same way as religion–I think that’s a fair comparison–it’s the persecution from the followers we want to eliminate, not the thing itself, just like we’d want to eliminate racism and sexism and not race and sex.
Triple post yay! Even with race, which is pretty much a social construction–the only “real” race, after all, is the human race–people should still be allowed to be proud of their heritage and ethnicity and race (as long as they don’t deny others their rights on the basis of it.)
Nahida: Yes, I donāt think the day will ever come when someone tells me, āWe canāt hire you because youāre a Pisces and theyāre all lazy daydreamers!ā(I refuse to become an Aquarius.)But that being said, I donāt think belief in astrology is something to be eliminated like sexism or racism. The fact that it has the potential to have the same effects isnāt good enough. Weād be going down a dangerous road. I’m not trying to say we should actively try to eliminate it. At present, the worst that ever really happens is probably refusal to date someone. If someone believes in astrology, the worst damage they’re doing is to them. I’m saying that astrology has less evidence in favor of it and more evidence against it than gender essentialism. However stupid you may think people are for believing something that’s just kind of entrenched in our culture, “Women can’t control their emotions,” people who believe the also fairly well entrenched “Your personality depends on what time of the year you were born,” are being stupider. And so, it’s hypocritical to fault someone for believing the less stupid thing when you yourself believe the more stupid thing. (And I am very intentionally using only comparisons: if you feel that sexism needs to be eliminated but we can’t actually fault people for sexism when they’re raised in a sexist society, then there’s nothing hypocritical about believing in or being attached to astrology.)
Nahida: Triple post yay! Even with race, which is pretty much a social constructionāthe only ārealā race, after all, is the human raceāpeople should still be allowed to be proud of their heritage and ethnicity and race (as long as they donāt deny others their rights on the basis of it.) Why would I be proud of something that I didn’t have a stake in creating? I’m proud of my academic accomplishments, I’m proud of all the time I’ve spent learning spanish or learning the guitar. I’m proud of programs that I’ve created or work that I’ve done. But why would I be proud of knowing english, or being white? Why would I be proud of being born in a certain place? What purpose is holding pride – admiration for those things that we can’t control, when pride implies a stake in creation, a responsability for that choice? I’m fine with other people being prideful of these things. Their pride doesn’t hurt me. But for me, that kind of pride is useless.
David: Iām fine with other people being prideful of these things. Their pride doesnāt hurt me. But for me, that kind of pride is useless. Exactly. That’s you. With all due respect David, I kinda felt that post was useless. =P I don’t feel a sense of pride in my race either. I don’t even really identify with any race. But others have the right to it, especially if it relates to how much they love their families, of their cultures as a special way to connect and understand their loved ones and their own identities–if it makes them think of things like that, (it doesn’t have to be an accomplishment you know) who’re we to judge? If it’s useless for you, we’ll leave it at that.
Lara Emily Foley: Lu Sorry but I don’t see how this answers my question. I know the article says your sign hasn’t changed, “in short,” but I don’t find that the article ever stated its point. First it says there’s this new reckoning of the signs, then it says it’s not really news and that your sign hasn’t changed.
David: Why would I be proud of something that I didnāt have a stake in creating? Iām proud of my academic accomplishments, Iām proud of all the time Iāve spent learning spanish or learning the guitar. Iām proud of programs that Iāve created or work that Iāve done.But why would I be proud of knowing english, or being white? Why would I be proud of being born in a certain place? What purpose is holding pride ā admiration for those things that we canāt control, when pride implies a stake in creation, a responsability for that choice?Iām fine with other people being prideful of these things. Their pride doesnāt hurt me. But for me, that kind of pride is useless. I think you might be confusing two senses of “pride” here. There’s the pride that you feel in your accomplishments, as in, “I feel good about what I’ve done” and then there’s another kind of pride. For other examples, feeling proud of being gay, or a former sex worker, a survivor, disabled, etc. etc. etc. Its saying, “I am part of this stigmatized group, and I love myself, and you can all go fuck yourselves.” You know?
For someone who doesn’t believe in astrology, it sure is unsettling how much I’m resistant to the change! I don’t WANT to be a stuffy old Capricorn >:(
