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I want women’s networks to stop glamorizing stalking

Really, WEtv?

Summary: White woman walks around town, sometimes eating unhealthy food (ice cream sundaes, etc). Thin white man follows her, and narrates his stalking — “I investigate people. I spy on them. I watch their every move. I dig through their lives. I look inside, so I can help them change the outside.” When she walks into her house, he’s there, with her husband — he introduces himself, and says, “I’m here to save your life.”

Because, you know, she’s fat.

I don’t want to get caught up in a discussion of whether or not she’s “really” fat, or whether she looks like she’s in danger of keeling over dead — because that’s an awfully tough call to make when you have no medical information at all. What bothers me about this ad — and the whole concept of the show in general — is (a) the premise that fat people are fat because they’re secretly miserable and therefore eat cupcakes all day; (b) the message fat people (and especially fat women) need to be saved from themselves; and (c) the assumption that women’s bodies are public property.

Stalking and harassing women in order to teach them the error of their ways is a pretty popular tactic among misogynists who get the vapors whenever a woman does something that transgresses social norms, whether that’s walking into an abortion clinic or speaking out publicly or having the nerve to eat while fat. But it’s particularly disappointing to see it on a network targeted at women.


52 thoughts on I want women’s networks to stop glamorizing stalking

  1. So how’s stalker-boy selecting his victims? Does he spend his day trolling for “fatties” on his own initiative, or does some passive-aggressive “loved one” have to rat them out on a tipline?

  2. Taking an ice cream sundae away from me and telling me, “No, it’s okay, I’ve been following you around and I’m here to save your life!” would be a pretty surefire way to get me to flip the frak out on you.

    I’m not sure why any woman would agree to be on this show, though I guess if she was nominated (read: shamed) by a husband or friend, I suppose I can understand the pressure.

  3. Open Letter to Any Woman Approached by this Show:

    You are well within your rights to tell the stalker to fuck off and then tell your “loving” relative/friend/spouse to go along for the ride.

    Love,

    Your Self Esteem

  4. This is why I can’t watch the show What Not to Wear. For a whole week they follow a woman around trying to catch her at her worst. Sometimes they even go through their personal belongings unknown to them (courtesy of the Concerned Family Member). Then they showcase all of this in front of her family and friends in a horrible surprise intervention. These women always look horrified but always end up going along because, probably, every man, woman, and child they know is sitting there laughing at them. On camera. Its just horrible and I really can’t believe no one has ever sued them or pressed charges.

  5. i just posted at feministing about this but when i went to the youtube page for this the comments left were about how hot the actress is. and no i dont think someone being fat is disturbing-what i do find disturbing is some idiot hiding in a car and stalking a woman to then come up to her and proclaim “i want to save your life”. theres a place for guys like him, its called PRISON!

  6. Kat (and others) – I can’t speak for the show that is the subject of this post, but What Not To Wear and others of that ilk obtain permission from the subject beforehand. The stalking/intervention bit is just kabuki. Of course, I think it might be interesting from a feminist standpoint to talk about why this particular trope is so popular in reality TV centered around women and appearance. But, consent-wise, no, actually, these women agree to be subjects of the show of their own volition. The production companies wouldn’t waste the money on following women around who might not want to do the show.

  7. @ amee: I tried to comment on the video but all comments have to be approved…

    If someone approached me like that I’ld probably run away and get hit by a car or something. That’s gonna be some fine saving.

  8. This looks like a bad joke. I think they have other ones, too, depicting drug addicts and the like. Because there’s a fair comparison.

  9. the premise that fat people are fat because they’re secretly miserable and therefore eat cupcakes all day
    I, personally, would be miserable a raging harpy if someone tried to STOP me from eating cupcakes.

  10. “Of course, I think it might be interesting from a feminist standpoint to talk about why this particular trope is so popular in reality TV centered around women and appearance.”

    Probably the same reason the “trick the bitch” genre of porn is so popular.

  11. I would *love* to produce a show that follows up on these sorts of shows after the fact (this, and what not to wear and wife swap and any other show where a family invites camera crews in to ridicule the wife/mother). See if the woman is still there, and how she felt about it after it had aired and edited to make her look as unflattering as possible.

  12. There seem to be a lot of “reality shows” lately with premises along the line of “constant shaming has failed to make these people not fat, so clearly the problem is that it wasn’t enough, and we should deploy some new, improved weapons-grade fat-shaming”. While flipping through channels one time I encountered (I think on the BBC or something like that) a show in which a woman (the show’s host) was berating another woman (the victim, who evidently volunteered for that sort of treatment) because her shit smelled bad. Literally.

    Made me lose some of my hope for humanity.

    This looks like more of the same, except the whole “secret” stalking adds some extra creepiness to the mix of emotional abuse and self-loathing.

  13. ugh. i’m glad you posted about this as i had not gotten around to it yet. this fucking “intervention for fatties” shit has to stop. following women around and going through their cupboards is not okay. i only saw one commercial with a man, and in that one his children and spouse were not present. with the ones aimed at women, it was their husbands and children laying on the guilt to put the damn ice cream down.

    what the hell. if i want to lose weight it isn’t going to be because someone else thinks they know best for me.

  14. Having been stalked, this sort of thing really squicks me out. A lot of stalkers convince themselves that they’re doing it for the target’s “own good.” If I was ever approached by this guy, and if a family member ever invited him to do this, I’d a) beat this fucker bloody b) kick said family member to the curb.

    Oh, and seriously? Can we PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE drop the whole “fat people are totally unhealthy and are going to dieeeeee” trope now? I’m pretty damn thin, and I’ve gotta tell ya, I’m far from fit. I don’t have much in the way of endurance when I jog (two minutes and I’m wheezing), and my back and core are pretty damn weak. The next moron who says that I “look” like I would be good at yoga or dancing or whatthefuck ever is going to get a good swift kick to the face for displaying stupidity on steroids. (No, I don’t think skinny women are oppressed for being skinny–that’s just more stupidity on steroids.) I just think it’s annoying to assume that think people are always fit and heavy people are always unhealthy. I know a lot of fat people who can run faster and farther than me, and who have far better flexibility and balance than I do. Not to mention better strength. FFS.

  15. Ugh. The thing that REALLY creeps me out about this is that the woman’s husband is obviously complicit in the stalking and “intervention” at the end. That and the looks of faux-sympathy-concern on their faces.

  16. Probably the same reason the “trick the bitch” genre of porn is so popular

    So something like: women aren’t supposed to be active participants in our lives, aren’t supposed to be self-aware, and aren’t supposed to speak up about what we want from life? So the idea is that you have this team of Experts ™ following women around waiting to ambush them with something like a makeover or an exercise regimen or whatever? Because we can’t be trusted to know what’s good for us.

    The especially interesting part, to me, is that, in that you have to establish very clear cut legal consent to even show someone on television (outside maybe a TV news context), you have to create a ruse to frame a totally willing participant as a passive sheep who needs to be herded into doing the right thing.

  17. This is so utterly weird. It’s the creepiest instance of stalking “for her own good” since the time campus cops at this one college stopped women on the street at night and handed them a card saying, “If I were a rapist, you’d be in trouble.”

    It doesn’t help that this guy has three names, like an accused criminal.

  18. Aaaagh, you mean it wasn’t just an ad? (come home tired, not reading too close)
    Like I didn’t get enough of “for your own good” before I was 10!
    If I could make my own show it would have the stalk-ee turn around, pull out a gun and take out everyone involved and then announce that the whole genre is going to die next.
    Someone’s idea of a later follow-up for these people who have endured this is a good one. Someone who’s good at journalism, investigation, etc., could try and look some of them up–without stalking them, of course.
    I can’t believe what goes on on tv these days, and i guess that’s why I don’t watch it. I know there’s a lot of people who think figuratively that their shit doesn’t stink, but anyone holding that idea literally and then insulting another person in public is, well, a shithead. What’s next, an onscreen shit-off with trained olfactory judges?
    I wish that the students in Bitter Scribe’s story had had cards made to hand to the cops saying “I’m armed–and if you were a rapist YOU’D be in trouble.”

  19. I am really surprised that they thought this commercial would attract viewers…for me, it is just unbelievably creepy. It would be one thing if she were seeking out his advice as a fitness consultant, but she isn’t; his advice is being foisted upon her because he supposedly can’t stand to watch her make unhealthy choices. He’s like the food police. One of the signs of an eating disorder is anxiety and self-consciousness about eating in public. Does he think that following people around criticizing their food choices is going to actually help them? Because I think it’s going to make them neurotic.

  20. “So something like: women aren’t supposed to be active participants in our lives, aren’t supposed to be self-aware, and aren’t supposed to speak up about what we want from life? So the idea is that you have this team of Experts ™ following women around waiting to ambush them with something like a makeover or an exercise regimen or whatever? Because we can’t be trusted to know what’s good for us.”

    I was thinking more along the lines that there’s a strong social undercurrent of anger directed at women who fail to be sufficiently ornamental in the same way there’s a social undercurrent of male anger directed at women who have the gall to not be RealDolls. As the porn merchants have figured out they get a better return on their product if there’s an element of dubious consent, so the makers of reality tv have found that they get a noticeably better viewer response if they can inject a just-this-side-of-overt amount of coercion and punishment into the narrative along with the more blatant humiliation. So you spend the extra staff-hours getting the footage you need to construct your “hunting the wild fatty” routine and have your moments of ritualized judgment, and the pay-off is that people who otherwise wouldn’t be playing along at home can hi5 themselves because they just saw a bitch get told.

    “It’s the creepiest instance of stalking “for her own good” since the time campus cops at this one college stopped women on the street at night and handed them a card saying, “If I were a rapist, you’d be in trouble.””

    Oh my fucking god.

  21. Wow… that’s just… wow, that’s so depressing and bizarre… unbelievable. There are so many things wrong with that, I don’t know where to start.

    Would they have any men on there, I wonder? Not that that would make it any better.

    I think this type of show reflects something embarrassing, even disturbing, about our society… or probably humanity…

  22. (this comment is being written after taking cough medicine, so if it doesn’t make sense blame Nyquil…)
    Call me silly, but I’m still pissed at the idea that someone can’t tell that they’re overweight to begin with– everyone colors overweight people as stupid, don’t ask me why. So overweight people are too stupid to figure out if they want/need to lose weight, stalker man now needs to come and enlighten us all? Are you fucking kidding me?

  23. Oh ffs. As others have mentioned, for legal reasons these shows can’t actually stalk people and film them without their permission, so the real question is why they think that this format will be appealing to female viewers. Do they think we all secretely want to be stalked by strange men in cars?

    Actually don’t answer that, it’s too depressing.

  24. The show has followed at least one man as well. He actually was obese. Though, that doesn’t make the show any better or remotely original.

  25. Well, you haven’t really been lied to any more than you’ve been lied to about the fact that Edward James Olmos is an Admiral. Reality TV is “real” in name only.

  26. Opoponax–I did wonder about those “you’re a crappy dresser!” shows, in terms of consent. But if any family member of mine even started the process of getting me on one of those shows, I’d rip them a new one. Who the fuck do they think they are? Thankfully, my family is not like that, and my husband has no desire to get a new asshole installed.

    Still, the show’s hosts make my blood boil when I see promos; I know they’re paid to be assholes, but being willing to shame and denigrate women into dressing in a more “approved” fashion (just like the female host, I notice) makes you a bad person, in my book. Definitely part of the problem.

    Other examples of the genre: You’re Living in Filth, Your Kids are Out of Control, and Your Yard Enrages the Neighbors. A despicable trend, even if the victims are willing.

    Had to stop watching Nanny shows too, because 3 out of 4 of those families had serious problems that required counseling, not chore charts.

  27. Emjaybee — I KNOW! I think part of what revolts me about these shows is that there are people who genuinely want to go on them to be publicly humiliated on national TV. Because, yeah, if anyone signed me up for anything like that, I don’t think I’d ever talk to them again. Even knowing that I’d find out through a phone call or a form letter rather than a full on televised intervention.

  28. While they obviously draw upon the same cultural vocabulary, I’m very hesitant to group a show like this with a show like “What Not to Wear”. The title of this show shows that the stakes are much higher, yet it obviously also gets people eager to be publicly humiliated. A clothing show is going to be lighter in tone. Oh, they have their “meaningful” moments, but they aren’t telling participants they are going to die if they don’t stop wearing mismatched colors. It says a lot about our culture that fat people internalize fat shame so much that they would be eager to be threatened with death on national TV.

  29. This reminds me of the Oprah episode (I don’t watch it of my own volition, it’s on where I work) where they “helped” someone with hoarding disorder. Sure, the person was on the show willingly. But it became obvious once they just started throwing out this person’s stuff, with this poor person having a panic attack and crying, that they needed counseling more than anything else. That episode was heartbreaking. It’s horrible to see these hack ‘experts’ going in and telling folks to just ‘pull up their bootstraps’.

    That is, assuming the show’s victim actually has a ‘problem’ in the first place.

  30. Ok, so others may disagree with me, but one show that I find to be a feminist-counter-narrative to these types of shows (though using similar tactics) is Nanny 911. I find that on that show, the standard story line is that dad is not involved enough, and mom is overworked. The intervention usually involves getting dad to do more, and giving mom some breaks. There is, of course, some mommy shaming, but often the focus is on how daddy can’t spend all his time watching TV while mom irons, cooks, cleans, and still expect to have a happy home life.

  31. what the frak is going on with society!! how in the frak can the women’s network be producing such a horrid show?!! stalking a woman around her hometown and then declaring to save her is completely ridiculous!! and humiliating and degrading!!!! this obsession with weight is getting completely out of hand. I am an overweight woman who has gained an excessive amount of weight due to heavy medications that I was instructed to take in order to save my life and don’t see how this creep man is going to propose to save my life. what, does he have a cure for my disease?! seriously!! we are responsible for ourselves and when we want help then we will ask for it. and some woman who are plus size are beautiful and in better shape and health than some of the skinniest women around. this network needs to take a look at its agenda and recognize that this issue is not an issue that needs to be promoted in such a reprehensible manner. what a sad commentary on our society.

  32. BStu – the reason I’ve been comparing them is that they both use the Reality TV trope of an “expert” stalking their subject and ambushing them with an enforced life change. Just because the overall tone is different doesn’t mean they don’t use the same basic narrative ideas. Just because Night Of The Living Dead is supposed to be scary, and Shaun Of The Dead is a comedy, that doesn’t mean they’re not both zombie movies.

  33. It’s the creepiest instance of stalking “for her own good” since the time campus cops at this one college stopped women on the street at night and handed them a card saying, “If I were a rapist, you’d be in trouble.”

    That one’s much creepier, since you can’t actually film people without consent — the reality TV thing is fictional stalking.

    I suppose the women would have gotten in lots of trouble had they smiled sweetly and said, “And if I were a cop killer, *you’d* be in trouble.”

  34. Oh, I understand the comparison, Opoponax. I just think it can’t be understated what a leap it is that a show is using that cultural language to issue direct death threats to the eager participants. Which just underscores the morphing of the cartoonish sneaking of “What Not to Wear” into the creeping stalking of “Come with me if you want to live” or whatever this show is.

  35. There is so much wrong here I’m not sure where to start.

    (I’m not even going to begin on the cop of campus and his “If I were a rapist” sign, except to think in the back of my head, “What makes you think I think you’re not one?”)

    The biggest problem I think I have (other than that this disaster is airing on the supposed “Womens’ Channel”, which speaks to a level of internalized self-hate I can’t even deal with right now) is hubby not just sanctioning, not just encouraging, but spearheading this mess.

    Because it rolls up a lot of the patriarchal, misogynistic, body image-related mess into one neat package.

    (As in: no, ladies, you don’t have to stop having a “socially approved” body just because you “got your man”, no matter what you do for a living — see SCOTUS — and no matter what else you have to do all day.)

    (Apparently the man on the series is only shamed as an individual. I find it telling that the women are shamed in front of the entire family.)

    But what I find even worse about that — especially in the face of this SCOTUS disaster — is the trend. The backlash.

    As women get closer and closer to actually becoming people in American/Western society, is anyone else noticing that the box into which the patriarchy requests — no, demands — that we fit (white, blonde, small nose, not 5 feet tall, not 6 feet tall, size single digit-8-6-4-2 …) gets smaller and smaller?

    And that the methods by which it attempts to put women in that box get more and more … forcible?

  36. You’re Living in Filth, Your Kids are Out of Control, and Your Yard Enrages the Neighbors. A despicable trend, even if the victims are willing.

    …are these real? (I don’t want to Google because I fear the answer… :p) I’ll admit I kind of like Nanny 911 and It’s Me or the Dog! because I think a lot of the time they do a sometimes-better job than the others of telling the adults what’s what (it’s really never actually the fault of the kids or the dogs) without shaming them, but they still allow me to be a little bit voyeuristic and mean. :p

    (Is ginmar being irrelevant to this discussion or am missing something?)

  37. And that the methods by which it attempts to put women in that box get more and more … forcible?

    Well, I wouldn’t compare being shamed by your television to imprisonment or enslavement or getting sent to a convent or married off against your will or whatever. I’d say the methods are a little more subtle now, if anything (I see this show as an exception to the quiet and non-physical but nasty idea of what’s an acceptable way to control women* nowadays.)

    *disclaimer: all that really bad stuff still happens to women, obviously. Your methods-of-control mileage will vary depending on the type of woman society sees you as.

  38. “…are these real?”

    Not verbatim, but the concepts are. I can think of three shows offhand that fall into the “You’re Living in Filth” slot (Neat, Clean Sweep, How Clean is Your House?). Nanny 911 has already been covered for the “Your Kids Are Out of Control,” but you could probably make an argument for “Honey, We’re Killing the Kids” falling into that bracket as well. “Garden Police” is the only one I can think of for “Your Yard Enrages the Neighbors,” though there was another one that revolved around finishing one big household project that always seemed to be outdoors whose name escapes me. Is it wrong that I kind of want there to really be an entry titled “Your Yard Enrages the Neighbors” on account of it being such a snazzy title?

  39. But it’s particularly disappointing to see it on a network targeted at women.

    The operative word here is “target.” So-called women’s networks are not on women’s side. Much like women’s magazines, their job is to shame women over and over for not being perfect, physically and mentally, so they will buy more products advertised.

  40. “hunting the wild fatty”

    ZOMG I want to star in that show. As the fatty.

  41. Yeah, my mom and I both hate this ad. Not only is it an invasion of privacy, but I feel really humiliated for the woman (yes, I know she’s probably just an actress, but still…it makes me uncomfotable).
    Has anyone seen the show?

  42. preying mantis, I’d totally wear a T-shirt that says Your Yard Enrages the Neighbors.

    And agreed, *targeting* here is a key word. We don’t expect women’t magazines to be any kind of liberating/feminist/ what-have-you, and the same is true of TV.

    Somehow all of these shows, from Get a Grip Fatty to Your Yard Enrages the Neighbors to all those countless dating shows in which your fuckability gets rated mercilessly in all public, make me think modern Colliseum games.
    You know, back in the old days it was real blood and gladiators and Christians being fed to lions, now we indulge in other people’s emotional torment.

    I think one big part of the appeal is the opportunity to point a finger and say “I’m not like that”, but I think another really important part is exactly the public shaming and humiliation, the severe discomfort, the sobby breakdowns. And on dating shows, the ridiculous cat fights.

    People just seem to draw some kind of deep satisfaction from watching others suffer.

  43. I wonder how much of “What Not to Wear” also has to do with class (probably the other shows, too).

    Here is a confession: I have sometimes thought it would be nice to be on that show. I am a PhD student, so I have been in University for over 10 years. This means that a) I have no money and b) all of my clothes are from the mid-90s. Furthermore, because I have been writing my dissertation for the last year, and in my discipline that involves a lot of sitting in front of a computer, I have also gained weight. Most of my clothes don’t fit very well. Next November I should be going on the job market, but all of my clothes look like I am in high school (or undergrad at best). So I have thought “It would be really nice to win a $5,000 new wardrobe.”

    But this is obviously classed in interesting ways. So you have to have enough social capital that dressing “professionally” matters, but not enough financial capital that you can afford a whole new professional wardrobe without being shamed first. If I were rich, I could hire someone to do my shopping for me. In the case of the other shows, I would be able to hire someone to help me with my weight (e.g. nutritionist or trainer), or kids, or whatever.

  44. So you have to have enough social capital that dressing “professionally” matters, but not enough financial capital that you can afford a whole new professional wardrobe without being shamed first.

    Which is the theme of a lot of their episodes. And which further makes the shaming aspect so much weirder. The shaming kind of “works” when their theme is someone who refuses to wear socially acceptable clothing or is just a complete wackaloon. Because there is a message to be conveyed – you MUST follow X rule, because there are Y consequences if you don’t. And to an extent defanged humiliation is a common vehicle for teaching those sorts of lessons, and there’s nothing all that terrible about it (except for the gender implications – the show was much less problematic when there were male subjects).

    But when the bulk of the subjects of your show are people who for whatever reason haven’t been able to afford to dress well, and for whom $5000 and professional advice is a welcome gift? Then it just becomes a way to shame people and/or symbolically take away women’s agency.

  45. This is disgusting. I am currently being stalked and what comes with it I can’t even begin to discuss but first comes a bit of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder.. Sound fun? I don’t think this man who’s getting these women to lose weight really has a full deck..

  46. This is disgusting. I am currently being stalked and what comes with it I can’t even begin to discuss but first comes a bit of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder.. Sound fun? I don’t think this man who’s getting these women to lose weight really has a full deck.. The women’s networks do make it seem like you can catch the stalker in the end and like law enforcement will work on your side. It doesn’t work like that really. Some of law enforcement cares but most doesn’t. The stalker has “his rights” to life, liberty, and the pursuit, etc… Mine moved into my neighborhood now. He still persists even though I have charges against him. So no, it’s no LifeT. story on a Saturday afternoon on your tv. I hope teenage girls realize that having a stalker doesn’t mean the guy likes you;) Thanks for listening….

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